Yes. If you have a background in Big4 in your home country, it would definitely be an advantage if you want to land a job at a Big4 here in the US. At the end of the day, you will know their culture and they will think you have the right fit there. If you come from a Big 4, you will know what I mean... On the other hand, the transition between Big 4 and a law firm could be more complicated.

I got it. As I know, quite a few people would go to the MBA program instead of LLM taxation after they work a few years in the Big 4. What will be the different between their graduates in terms of landing a job in the US after study? Will good employers like big 4 have preference between them? Thanks

Honestly, if I had invested 120K and 2 years of my life in an MBA, I would NEVER work at a Big4. Believe me, people who earn an MBA from a decent business school do not 1) want to work with taxation; 2) want to work at a Big4. These guys try to land jobs at investment banks or top consultancy firms (e.g. McKinsey, etc.).

I got it. As I know, quite a few people would go to the MBA program instead of LLM taxation after they work a few years in the Big 4. What will be the different between their graduates in terms of landing a job in the US after study? Will good employers like big 4 have preference between them? Thanks

Taxation is decent enough for me. But my point was: if a lawyer pursues an MBA, it is because he/she wants a career change - most of the times, they want jobs not related with law. If a lawyer wants to stick to tax law, he/ she will probably pursue an LLM, not an MBA. There may be exceptions, of course (in some countries, some lower-tier schools offer MBAs of various specialties), but I do not think that an MBA will do you any good if you want a career in tax.

International Tax Law course in Leiden University in Netherlands is really great!

Taxation is decent enough for me. But my point was: if a lawyer pursues an MBA, it is because he/she wants a career change - most of the times, they want jobs not related with law. If a lawyer wants to stick to tax law, he/ she will probably pursue an LLM, not an MBA. There may be exceptions, of course (in some countries, some lower-tier schools offer MBAs of various specialties), but I do not think that an MBA will do you any good if you want a career in tax.

Ok. Let´s build 3 different scenarios: a) you have big4 experience in your home country; b) you have law firm experience in your home country; c) you have no experience in your home country.

If you are in a), you may land a job in a Big4 in the US after the LLM if your grades are decent (an average above B). You will only be able to land a job in a big law firm in the US if your grades are high (i.e. above B+). And if you want to return to your home country, you will be able to land jobs either in Big 4s and law firms.

If you are in b), same applies - except that you may secure a temporary position in an American big law firm even if your grades are not top grades. At the end of the day, law firms here are interested in making contacts with lawyers from different jurisdictions to whom they can refer/ receive work in the futute.

C)´s case is similar to a)´s, although in this case, decent grades are a must.

In summary, where international Tax LLMs are likely to work after graduation depends on 1) grades; 2) background. But grades are essential.

Ok. Let´s build 3 different scenarios: a) you have big4 experience in your home country; b) you have law firm experience in your home country; c) you have no experience in your home country.

If you are in a), you may land a job in a Big4 in the US after the LLM if your grades are decent (an average above B). You will only be able to land a job in a big law firm in the US if your grades are high (i.e. above B+). And if you want to return to your home country, you will be able to land jobs either in Big 4s and law firms.

If you are in b), same applies - except that you may secure a temporary position in an American big law firm even if your grades are not top grades. At the end of the day, law firms here are interested in making contacts with lawyers from different jurisdictions to whom they can refer/ receive work in the futute.

C)´s case is similar to a)´s, although in this case, decent grades are a must.

In summary, where international Tax LLMs are likely to work after graduation depends on 1) grades; 2) background. But grades are essential.

Q: I guess you are an alumni of NYU taxation law?

A: Current student, NYU, LL.M. (International Tax).

Q: I heard that prestigous LLM programs usually have bias upon international students, is that true?

A: No.

Q: About how many international students were there in your class?

A: We were 28 in my program. But we had no special classes only for international students - in all of them there were GTPs and JDs. I would say that in a big class like International Tax I & II (70 students), 35 could have been foreigners. In other courses, like Partnership Tax (50 students), there were only 3 foreigners. Conclusion: it depends on the courses you take.

Q: Any scholarship available?

A: Yes. Apart from the general scholarships granted by NYU (read other threads and you will know which ones are offered), there is the Wallace scholarship for ITP candidates.

Q: If yes,what would be the most important criteria of an candidate?

A: No idea.

Ivan2006, I am currently a 2L at a top 50 law school. I am interested in an LLM in taxation, specifically from NYU. Can you tell me a little about the application process? Is admission ridiculously competitve? What must my law school grades look like? What is the application process?

Thank you in advance.
NCSUUNC

Q: I guess you are an alumni of NYU taxation law?

A: Current student, NYU, LL.M. (International Tax).

Q: I heard that prestigous LLM programs usually have bias upon international students, is that true?

A: No.

Q: About how many international students were there in your class?

A: We were 28 in my program. But we had no special classes only for international students - in all of them there were GTPs and JDs. I would say that in a big class like International Tax I & II (70 students), 35 could have been foreigners. In other courses, like Partnership Tax (50 students), there were only 3 foreigners. Conclusion: it depends on the courses you take.

Q: Any scholarship available?

A: Yes. Apart from the general scholarships granted by NYU (read other threads and you will know which ones are offered), there is the Wallace scholarship for ITP candidates.

Q: If yes,what would be the most important criteria of an candidate?

A: No idea.

New 2008 U.S. News Tax Rankings
The new 2008 U.S. News Law School Tax Rankings are out and available on-line here. U.S. News ranked the Top 25 this year (with ties); here are the Top 10:

1. NYU (#1 last year)
2. Florida (#2)
3. Georgetown (#3)
4. Northwestern (#4)
5. Harvard (#5)
6. Miami (#5)
7. UCLA (#7)
8. Boston University (#7)
9. Texas (#15)
10. San Diego (#9)
10. Virginia (#11)
10. Yale (#11)
The biggest upward moves are:

+6 Texas (#9)
+3 Loyola-L.A. (#16)
The biggest downward moves are:

-6 USC (#21)
-5 U. Washington (#18)
-4 Stanford (#13)
-2 Denver (#21)
Last year, U.S. News ranked the Top 21 schools. Five schools that were unranked last year made this year's Top 25: Duke (#14), Penn (#18), Boston College (#21), Columbia (#21), and Florida State (#21).

One school that was in last year's Top 21 dropped out of the rankings this year: Chicago (#17 last year)

The 12 schools with graduate tax programs included in the rankings are the same as last year:

1. NYU (#1 last year)
2. Florida (#2)
3. Georgetown (#3)
4. Northwestern (#4)
5. Miami (#5)
6. Boston University (#6)
7. San Diego (#7)
8. Loyola-L.A. (#10)
9. SMU (#9)
10. U. Washington (#8)
11. Villanova (#10)
12. Denver (#10)
Loyola-L.A. is the only graduate tax program to move up (+2) in the rankings; Denver (-2), University of Washington (-2), and Villanova (-1) all moved down.

The new tax rankings are surprisingly anticlimactic. I was expecting something like UF and GLC trading places, along with some shifting below that. Really, there is nothing new (except for Loyola's small climb and UW's move down--which seem rather insignificant).

Im new here, and im thinking of doing the Taxation Program (LL.M) at the University of Miami, can someone tell me if its a good program and if i have good chances of finding a good job after the program?

I graduated from the LLM program at Miami and think that it is a great program. It's challenging and the faculty is incredibly well known. Yes, it doesnt have quite the reputation as NYU or Gtown but it is considered the best for International Tax. NYU's international tax LLM is for international students. Also, if you want to practice in Florida or the Southeast in general, it carries a lot of weight because the alumni in the area. Hope this helps!

I have an LL.M. in Tax from NYU.

Just add that I think Ivans comments were all quite accurate. The NYU LL.M. program (and the law school J.D. and in general) has been ranked #1 in tax (and top 6 law schools generally) for many decades. That is for good reason.

Someone asked is admission competitive. Of course it is at the consistently #1 ranked program and being in NYC where many law firms and corporations readily aborb such graduates (I started with Wall Street firm out of NYU). However, if you are serious about it and have decent law school grades or special tax background or excelled in tax courses at a good law school in their J.D. program and/or have some good tax professor recommendors ... THEN GO FOR IT (apply). A good J.D. GPA is best way for acceptance, but some of those other factors might compensate some for a less than stellar GPA. There ARE EXCEPTIONS to the generalizations on GPA at most law schools if other factors make a candidate look attractive based on dedication, work or study background in the relevant area, strong/respected recommendations, etc. Anyone who can get in and afford NYU LL.M. and does not do so, if interested in tax law, really needs to sit and do some serious reflecting (to put it mildly).

Concerning University of Florida Law School. It is a great law school and college (ranked Tier 1 law school) and its outstanding tax program dates back to at least the 1950's when the tax faculties at UF and NYU co-authored leading tax texts and moved between to two law schools to teach (Professors Friedland and Stevens and others). The smaller size of Gainesville (mentioned by someone) is irrelevant to the quality of that LL.M. degree, although NYC is better in terms of convience and connections to employment in N.E. USA.

Between UF and U. of Miami ... U. of Miami has come a long way in recent decades and apparently they have a good LL.M. Tax program ... but clearly University of Florida is the one nipping at NYU's hills and consistently rated #2 for TAX LL.M for a long time. So if you don't go to NYU and can get in U.F. that would be an excellent choice, as would George Washington with its D.C. location.

It should be noted that University of Florida is even offering a rare J.S.D. degree in Tax Law. That is a post-LL.M. doctorate of law. I don't know anything about that program but it does tend to show how far UF is in Tax Law Study. It was the first and only such program I heard of to offer further tax law study and degree BEYOND the LL.M. (Tax).

Rob

Thank Rob for your detailed information! Do you mind telling us whether you got your LLM degree right after graduation (JD?) or after several years of working experience in Tax?
Besides, I notice that Harvard Tax Law program ranks five (which is also quite good) but few people comment on it. How is this program of this prestigous school, in terms of reputation and job placement? Does the fame of "Harvard" make it harder apply to than the No.1 NYU? Thank you very much for your sharing!!

ANSWER: I went directly from JD graduation into LL.M. (tax) at NYU. I do not know it to be a fact but have heard that NYU (like many of the MBA programs now) has a preferance now for those with some experience coming back for the LL.M. in tax. That was not a factor when I attended.

I don't know anything about the Harvard LL.M. in tax except that it did not exist until pretty recently, so its sort of an unknown quantity as far as their LL.M. (Tax) program goes.

While Harvard is big name school, NYU ranks close behind as a J.D. law school and clearly way out in front for LL.M. in tax. Based upon that fact, I would assume that NYU would get more applications and be first choice for more lawyers wanting the LL.M. in Tax. I don't know how many Harvard admits to their program, perhaps its very small? Unless the Harvard program is very small, I would limagine the NYU Tax LL.M. admission would be harder to get (smaller % accepted). Again, I do not have actual facts and this is just my assumption.

As far as jobs go, I would imagine Harvard LL.M. graduates do not have too much trouble getting jobs. However, when it comes to tax lawyers, I think most big firms and those in the know would prefer to get an NYU LL.M. Tax graduate from the long-time #1 tax law program in US.

Rob

Harvard LLM program is for those that want to teach law. Harvard doesnt have a tax llm program, rather it's a concentration and you have to write a thesis with faculty approval. The rankings yoiu are referring to are prestige of law schools in certain specialities at the JD level (e.g., dispute resolution, trial advocacy, etc.) There are also rankings specifically for tax programs which isnt hard to find on other posts here, or on the internet.

i am a 2nd year eyeing the possibility of going after a llm in taxation. I already will have considerable debt from law school.... is there a list that shows the cost of attendance of llm schools?