Some of the information and numbers being thrown around in this thread shouldn't be taken as holy writ.
I can only speak for Oxford, and about Canadians, but this idea that your class rank needs to be tied to the "rank" of your school isn't anything I've observed. There are at least 6 Canadians in the BCL this year, and we're all from different schools, spanning the (largely imaginary) range of Canadian institutions. We're not all gold medalists, and I don't think there's a publication between us. We ran a relatively narrow gauntlet of work experience, from 4 years to none.
So far as I can tell, the idea that a country's "second-best" applicant will necessarily be bumped in favour of another country's "first-best" applicant is most likely a hallucination brought about by writing too many internet forum posts.
Moderation in all things, people.
Some Facts to be in Top law Schools
Posted Jan 23, 2009 17:00
I can only speak for Oxford, and about Canadians, but this idea that your class rank needs to be tied to the "rank" of your school isn't anything I've observed. There are at least 6 Canadians in the BCL this year, and we're all from different schools, spanning the (largely imaginary) range of Canadian institutions. We're not all gold medalists, and I don't think there's a publication between us. We ran a relatively narrow gauntlet of work experience, from 4 years to none.
So far as I can tell, the idea that a country's "second-best" applicant will necessarily be bumped in favour of another country's "first-best" applicant is most likely a hallucination brought about by writing too many internet forum posts.
Moderation in all things, people.
Posted Jan 23, 2009 17:04
Exception is----- your work ex. for top law schools in USA if you do not have LSAC top grade with top class rank (top 15 %)..
Posted Jan 23, 2009 17:06
Some of the information and numbers being thrown around in this thread shouldn't be taken as holy writ.
I can only speak for Oxford, and about Canadians, but this idea that your class rank needs to be tied to the "rank" of your school isn't anything I've observed. There are at least 6 Canadians in the BCL this year, and we're all from different schools, spanning the (largely imaginary) range of Canadian institutions. We're not all gold medalists, and I don't think there's a publication between us. We ran a relatively narrow gauntlet of work experience, from 4 years to none.
So far as I can tell, the idea that a country's "second-best" applicant will necessarily be bumped in favour of another country's "first-best" applicant is most likely a hallucination brought about by writing too many internet forum posts.
Moderation in all things, people.
I would repeat what I have said so many times. There are too many varying examples to know a set pattern. Apply and see for yourself.
I can only speak for Oxford, and about Canadians, but this idea that your class rank needs to be tied to the "rank" of your school isn't anything I've observed. There are at least 6 Canadians in the BCL this year, and we're all from different schools, spanning the (largely imaginary) range of Canadian institutions. We're not all gold medalists, and I don't think there's a publication between us. We ran a relatively narrow gauntlet of work experience, from 4 years to none.
So far as I can tell, the idea that a country's "second-best" applicant will necessarily be bumped in favour of another country's "first-best" applicant is most likely a hallucination brought about by writing too many internet forum posts.
Moderation in all things, people.
</blockquote>
I would repeat what I have said so many times. There are too many varying examples to know a set pattern. Apply and see for yourself.
Posted Jan 23, 2009 17:08
A lot of bullshit is being thrown around in this thread imo.
Bottomline is this: If you meet the conditions/requirements that they have laid down, you have a chance.
HLS/SLS/LSE/CLS/Yale: Work-ex with strong academics.
Oxbridge: First Class with "top 10% of high rank uni/ top5% of 2nd tier/ a first or second position from 3rd tier".
LSE: I was admitted with just a strong cum laude degree, no work experience. Plusses are internship at magic circle firm and erasmus exchange to Sorbonne.
HLS/CLS/SLS/Yale: Work experience is not needed, it helps, but the absolute top students of each year can get into Harvard and CLS, top students who teach can get into Yale.
Penn/Northwestern and rest of law schools (among top 15)
- LSAC 'A' grade with 2 year work ex.
Work experience is not needed for my country for most of the top fifteen schools, if you have a decent application package with good grades.
<blockquote>Bottomline is this: If you meet the conditions/requirements that they have laid down, you have a chance.
HLS/SLS/LSE/CLS/Yale: Work-ex with strong academics.
Oxbridge: First Class with "top 10% of high rank uni/ top5% of 2nd tier/ a first or second position from 3rd tier".
</blockquote>
LSE: I was admitted with just a strong cum laude degree, no work experience. Plusses are internship at magic circle firm and erasmus exchange to Sorbonne.
HLS/CLS/SLS/Yale: Work experience is not needed, it helps, but the absolute top students of each year can get into Harvard and CLS, top students who teach can get into Yale.
<blockquote>
Penn/Northwestern and rest of law schools (among top 15)
- LSAC 'A' grade with 2 year work ex.
</blockquote>
Work experience is not needed for my country for most of the top fifteen schools, if you have a decent application package with good grades.
Posted Jan 23, 2009 17:22
frien.. so far i have written in my posts regarding the system existing with and within a country, that how a university choose a student from a country.... i have no where talked about in my post regarding the fight between toppers from different countries and i have specifically said that i will also continue on that topic ( see first page)... so please read it again...however there can be 6 Canadian students in Oxford BCL as you have said... that can be true as 80% population of Canada have European ethnic origin.. like to be or study in EU... and so far Uk is there first choice.... Am i right...?
Posted Jan 23, 2009 17:28
Jagsmehn: "Bottomline is this... [for] Oxbridge: First Class with top 10% of high rank uni/ top5% of 2nd tier/ a first or second position from 3rd tier".
Bender: "No".
Jagsmehn: "There are too many varying examples to know a set pattern. Apply and see for yourself".
Bender: "I think you just claimed to know a set pattern, and posted as much on the internet, for everyone to see."
Bender: "No".
Jagsmehn: "There are too many varying examples to know a set pattern. Apply and see for yourself".
Bender: "I think you just claimed to know a set pattern, and posted as much on the internet, for everyone to see."
Posted Jan 23, 2009 17:31
Jagsmehn: "Bottomline is this... [for] Oxbridge: First Class with top 10% of high rank uni/ top5% of 2nd tier/ a first or second position from 3rd tier".
Bender: "No".
Jagsmehn: "There are too many varying examples to know a set pattern. Apply and see for yourself".
Bender: "I think you just claimed to know a set pattern, and posted as much on the internet."
Could you point out the post where I wrote the set pattern? May be you are confusing "have a chance" with recieving an offer. They are miles apart. I would welcome if you could pin-point the impugned remarks.
Bender: "No".
Jagsmehn: "There are too many varying examples to know a set pattern. Apply and see for yourself".
Bender: "I think you just claimed to know a set pattern, and posted as much on the internet."
</blockquote>
Could you point out the post where I wrote the set pattern? May be you are confusing "have a chance" with recieving an offer. They are miles apart. I would welcome if you could pin-point the impugned remarks.
Posted Jan 23, 2009 17:36
No.. we have never claimed that we are the most authentic or true regarding our discussion.... because we are not in the admission committee.. we just opined some facts... we also need your suggestions buddy.. do not take it personal.... so please take a look on it again and put some light...
Posted Jan 23, 2009 18:01
for NYU- they prefer lawyers ( for grades i cant say, they prefer work ex)
(success rate- 20%, because they have many seats so every applicant apply)
(success rate- 20%, because they have many seats so every applicant apply)
Posted Jan 23, 2009 18:07
And please it is only my openion... not a universal truth....
Posted Jan 23, 2009 18:10
haha...
you must use the line as a statutory warning in every post for it may hurt and bend someone's tender feelings
you must use the line as a statutory warning in every post for it may hurt and bend someone's tender feelings
Posted Jan 23, 2009 18:14
ha ha... true.. as i have witnessed this incident on this post...
Posted Jan 23, 2009 18:29
Moderation in all things, people.
Thank you, Bender, for your insight. Canadians are known for their moderation (that's why you are such good neighbors....You do your best to keep us Americans realistic.).
The dizzying speculation in this thread, while fun, has given me a headache. As an American with fairly extensive knowledge of law programs in the U.S., I can assure you that much of the information written in this thread about U.S. programs is inaccurate.
A friend is in charge of the initial "weeding out" of graduate applications across a variety of disciplines at a top U.S. school. Most applicants have top grades and equivalent credentials. The difference between candidates often hangs on the most slender of reeds. Something in the application that catches his eye may very well be the difference between rejection and a referral onward.
In the long run, luck plays a large role in U.S. admissions. Moreover, do not overlook the fact that personal connections trump nearly all of the factors discussed in this thread. Such connections do not necessarily include references from a "name" professor. In the US, monetary donations, personal and business contacts, and family connections will nearly always trump "name" professors, good grades, potential, and brilliance. Fair or not, it's reality.
Thank you, Bender, for your insight. Canadians are known for their moderation (that's why you are such good neighbors....You do your best to keep us Americans realistic.).
The dizzying speculation in this thread, while fun, has given me a headache. As an American with fairly extensive knowledge of law programs in the U.S., I can assure you that much of the information written in this thread about U.S. programs is inaccurate.
A friend is in charge of the initial "weeding out" of graduate applications across a variety of disciplines at a top U.S. school. Most applicants have top grades and equivalent credentials. The difference between candidates often hangs on the most slender of reeds. Something in the application that catches his eye may very well be the difference between rejection and a referral onward.
In the long run, luck plays a large role in U.S. admissions. Moreover, do not overlook the fact that personal connections trump nearly all of the factors discussed in this thread. Such connections do not necessarily include references from a "name" professor. In the US, monetary donations, personal and business contacts, and family connections will nearly always trump "name" professors, good grades, potential, and brilliance. Fair or not, it's reality.
Posted Jan 23, 2009 18:47
:) thanks to tel us some valid points as you have made.. i have already discussed your luck factor.. but i was unaware of that "personal connections trump nearly all of the factors discussed in thread" . please put some more light on related topic for the interest of readers so that they may not be misguided...
Posted Jan 23, 2009 19:29
Some of the information and numbers being thrown around in this thread shouldn't be taken as holy writ.
I can only speak for Oxford, and about Canadians, but this idea that your class rank needs to be tied to the "rank" of your school isn't anything I've observed. There are at least 6 Canadians in the BCL this year, and we're all from different schools, spanning the (largely imaginary) range of Canadian institutions. We're not all gold medalists, and I don't think there's a publication between us. We ran a relatively narrow gauntlet of work experience, from 4 years to none.
So far as I can tell, the idea that a country's "second-best" applicant will necessarily be bumped in favour of another country's "first-best" applicant is most likely a hallucination brought about by writing too many internet forum posts.
Moderation in all things, people.
Bender,
many thanks for your reality check. Cheers
I can only speak for Oxford, and about Canadians, but this idea that your class rank needs to be tied to the "rank" of your school isn't anything I've observed. There are at least 6 Canadians in the BCL this year, and we're all from different schools, spanning the (largely imaginary) range of Canadian institutions. We're not all gold medalists, and I don't think there's a publication between us. We ran a relatively narrow gauntlet of work experience, from 4 years to none.
So far as I can tell, the idea that a country's "second-best" applicant will necessarily be bumped in favour of another country's "first-best" applicant is most likely a hallucination brought about by writing too many internet forum posts.
Moderation in all things, people.
</blockquote>
Bender,
many thanks for your reality check. Cheers
Posted Jan 23, 2009 19:49
By far i have no where written like this as said by you in this Board
"the idea that a country's "second-best" applicant will necessarily be bumped in favour of another country's "first-best" applicant is most likely a hallucination brought about by writing too many internet forum posts."
if you know better than share with us as message board is free for all of us to share..... In fact you have not seen my post as i have written many times that what i have said is not a universal truth and anyone can correct it if he know better.... and i have no intention to break the hearts of those who are not in the race... do not take it personal my frien :)
"the idea that a country's "second-best" applicant will necessarily be bumped in favour of another country's "first-best" applicant is most likely a hallucination brought about by writing too many internet forum posts."
if you know better than share with us as message board is free for all of us to share..... In fact you have not seen my post as i have written many times that what i have said is not a universal truth and anyone can correct it if he know better.... and i have no intention to break the hearts of those who are not in the race... do not take it personal my frien :)
Posted Jan 23, 2009 20:03
I have also invited some more people to discuss about this topic from different Message Boards.... i hope we may get some good information by than... :)
Posted Jan 23, 2009 20:49
Here is some evidence to support what i have said...
cambridge says they require among 5-10% in their class.. read para 1 in their website
visit
http://www.law.cam.ac.uk/courses/llm/academic_and_language_requirements.php
harvard law school website states that-
visit harvard at
http://www.law.harvard.edu/prospective/gradprogram/llm/eligibility/index.html
Admissions Criteria
Admission to the LL.M. Program is highly competitive. Last year approximately 1,500 applicants competed for around 150 places in the LL.M. Program. Most applicants are fully qualified for the program, and the Committee on Graduate Studies must select from among a large number of candidates who have excellent credentials. In evaluating applications, the Committee takes into consideration the applicant's grades and rank in his or her law and other university studies, letters of recommendation, occupational interests, professional and personal accomplishments, and other factors, including the following:
For LL.M. Applicants from Abroad
The Program is designed for intellectually curious and thoughtful candidates who come from a variety of legal systems and backgrounds and who have demonstrated an intent to return to their country to contribute to the academy or legal profession. We are equally interested in applicants pursuing careers in law teaching and research, government service, the judiciary, international organizations, non-governmental organizations and private practice.
For LL.M. Applicants from the United States
The Program is designed for graduates of U.S. law schools who have had at least two or three years of experience beyond law school and who have committed themselves to a career in law teaching. In the admissions process, the Committee focuses primarily on applicants who have excelled in their basic law school studies, who elicit strong letters of recommendation from law school teachers and others familiar with their work, and who have spent at least two years working as a law school teacher, judicial clerk, or practitioner in a public agency or private practice. Evidence of graduate education in a field other than law is also significant. Weight will be given to materials demonstrating the applicant's interest in, commitment to, and capability for a career in law teaching.
visit LSE website
http://www.lse.ac.uk/collections/studentRecruitment/country/Default.htm
by far i am right..... so this is the universal truth...
cambridge says they require among 5-10% in their class.. read para 1 in their website
visit
http://www.law.cam.ac.uk/courses/llm/academic_and_language_requirements.php
harvard law school website states that-
visit harvard at
http://www.law.harvard.edu/prospective/gradprogram/llm/eligibility/index.html
Admissions Criteria
Admission to the LL.M. Program is highly competitive. Last year approximately 1,500 applicants competed for around 150 places in the LL.M. Program. Most applicants are fully qualified for the program, and the Committee on Graduate Studies must select from among a large number of candidates who have excellent credentials. In evaluating applications, the Committee takes into consideration the applicant's grades and rank in his or her law and other university studies, letters of recommendation, occupational interests, professional and personal accomplishments, and other factors, including the following:
For LL.M. Applicants from Abroad
The Program is designed for intellectually curious and thoughtful candidates who come from a variety of legal systems and backgrounds and who have demonstrated an intent to return to their country to contribute to the academy or legal profession. We are equally interested in applicants pursuing careers in law teaching and research, government service, the judiciary, international organizations, non-governmental organizations and private practice.
For LL.M. Applicants from the United States
The Program is designed for graduates of U.S. law schools who have had at least two or three years of experience beyond law school and who have committed themselves to a career in law teaching. In the admissions process, the Committee focuses primarily on applicants who have excelled in their basic law school studies, who elicit strong letters of recommendation from law school teachers and others familiar with their work, and who have spent at least two years working as a law school teacher, judicial clerk, or practitioner in a public agency or private practice. Evidence of graduate education in a field other than law is also significant. Weight will be given to materials demonstrating the applicant's interest in, commitment to, and capability for a career in law teaching.
visit LSE website
http://www.lse.ac.uk/collections/studentRecruitment/country/Default.htm
by far i am right..... so this is the universal truth...
Posted Jan 23, 2009 20:57
visit columbia law school website
"work experience is necessary"
http://www.law.columbia.edu/llm_jsd/llm/standards
Admission Standards
Strong preference is given to applicants who have at least one year of work experience after earning their first law degree. Only in exceptional circumstances are applications from candidates who are in their final year of law school considered. Applicants who have not yet graduated must demonstrate that their admission to the program would enable them to realize an immediate and specific career objective that would not otherwise be attainable.
A. Graduates of Law Schools in the United States
Admission to candidacy for the LL.M. degree is restricted, in the case of graduates of law schools in the U.S., to graduates of A.B.A.-accredited law schools who achieved honor status in their undergraduate legal studies as evidenced by very high academic standing, by membership on their law reviews, or by outstanding work in research. Generally, preference is given to candidates who have acquired at least two years of significant professional legal experience subsequent to graduation.
"work experience is necessary"
http://www.law.columbia.edu/llm_jsd/llm/standards
Admission Standards
Strong preference is given to applicants who have at least one year of work experience after earning their first law degree. Only in exceptional circumstances are applications from candidates who are in their final year of law school considered. Applicants who have not yet graduated must demonstrate that their admission to the program would enable them to realize an immediate and specific career objective that would not otherwise be attainable.
A. Graduates of Law Schools in the United States
Admission to candidacy for the LL.M. degree is restricted, in the case of graduates of law schools in the U.S., to graduates of A.B.A.-accredited law schools who achieved honor status in their undergraduate legal studies as evidenced by very high academic standing, by membership on their law reviews, or by outstanding work in research. Generally, preference is given to candidates who have acquired at least two years of significant professional legal experience subsequent to graduation.
Posted Jan 23, 2009 20:58
I need more suggestions on this topic.. may be still i am not right... :)
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