Alterntive Careers


Mr Easter
The biggest concern for all LLMs is job prospects after graduation. And the concensus is that LLMs are at significant disadvantage compared to JD counterparts in securing perminant roles in law firms. LLMs (even in top 10 law schools) are expected to come under significant pressure due to the economic/fin market downturn. The news from recruitment consultants and lawyers in US is that the work is drying up and LLM hiring is expected to decline very significantly--- some have suggested that it will not exist at all.

From my conversation with Partners at two major US law firms, LLMs from top schools who have the right experience and connections should still be able to secure roles. However, many will be dissapointed.

That being said, I would like to have a discussion regarding alternative career choices for LLMs. I suspect most will have legal working experience and will be going for jobs at top commercial law firms. But what about positions in corporations, Investment banks, consulting practices, NGOs, Int orgs like UN etc?

Are my fellow LLMs interested in these positions? OR are we all gunning for that associate position at law firms? I've been looking into management consulting which seems to be open to "advanced degree graduates". Masters students can also apply to a range of entry level positions, but I suspect most LLMs (especially one who've had significant experience) think their too good for entry level positions. What are everyone's thought on this? Has anyone looked into alternative positions?
The biggest concern for all LLMs is job prospects after graduation. And the concensus is that LLMs are at significant disadvantage compared to JD counterparts in securing perminant roles in law firms. LLMs (even in top 10 law schools) are expected to come under significant pressure due to the economic/fin market downturn. The news from recruitment consultants and lawyers in US is that the work is drying up and LLM hiring is expected to decline very significantly--- some have suggested that it will not exist at all.

From my conversation with Partners at two major US law firms, LLMs from top schools who have the right experience and connections should still be able to secure roles. However, many will be dissapointed.

That being said, I would like to have a discussion regarding alternative career choices for LLMs. I suspect most will have legal working experience and will be going for jobs at top commercial law firms. But what about positions in corporations, Investment banks, consulting practices, NGOs, Int orgs like UN etc?

Are my fellow LLMs interested in these positions? OR are we all gunning for that associate position at law firms? I've been looking into management consulting which seems to be open to "advanced degree graduates". Masters students can also apply to a range of entry level positions, but I suspect most LLMs (especially one who've had significant experience) think their too good for entry level positions. What are everyone's thought on this? Has anyone looked into alternative positions?
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I have spoken with several attorneyes in New York, Phili and Florida; my feed back is that you are on your own the day you clear bar exam of any one State in USA;

since one can legally stay in USA for one year after LL.M, the candidate is required to pass Bar Exam of any one of the States; once you are a licenced attorney, there is absolutely no dearth of work.

A friend (LL.M from CWRU) told me that by working for one year post-LL.M, he was able to recover all the expense incurred on LL.M.

therefore, nothing to worry about a job after LL.M and there is no need to make alternative career plans only for this fear.
I have spoken with several attorneyes in New York, Phili and Florida; my feed back is that you are on your own the day you clear bar exam of any one State in USA;

since one can legally stay in USA for one year after LL.M, the candidate is required to pass Bar Exam of any one of the States; once you are a licenced attorney, there is absolutely no dearth of work.

A friend (LL.M from CWRU) told me that by working for one year post-LL.M, he was able to recover all the expense incurred on LL.M.

therefore, nothing to worry about a job after LL.M and there is no need to make alternative career plans only for this fear.
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mnementh
Thanks nriattorney, this sounds peachy, but he must have been exceptionally good. I doubt one year is enough to cover the LL.M tuition + living expenses of that year. More like two years. If we're talking about a starting salary $140,000? That's $70,000 after tax ?

If you're on your own it sounds quite good if you're competitive and marketable, and I hope you're correct... then again, if you need to pass the bar exam first, then you're down to August, and then you're searching for the position while being unemployed and rent in NYC is $2000.... this amounts up to a fortune.

Can you stay with the OPT while being unemployed ?

Also, will small-medium law firm even want foreign LLB/LLM? There is no dearth of work, but there is no limit to the amount of JD's... of course you can be much better than them, but you're still foreign - what added value will "you" (not you specifically) add to a firm with no foreign business? "Your" english is not as good and there's a mess with the visa I presume...
Thanks nriattorney, this sounds peachy, but he must have been exceptionally good. I doubt one year is enough to cover the LL.M tuition + living expenses of that year. More like two years. If we're talking about a starting salary $140,000? That's $70,000 after tax ?

If you're on your own it sounds quite good if you're competitive and marketable, and I hope you're correct... then again, if you need to pass the bar exam first, then you're down to August, and then you're searching for the position while being unemployed and rent in NYC is $2000.... this amounts up to a fortune.

Can you stay with the OPT while being unemployed ?

Also, will small-medium law firm even want foreign LLB/LLM? There is no dearth of work, but there is no limit to the amount of JD's... of course you can be much better than them, but you're still foreign - what added value will "you" (not you specifically) add to a firm with no foreign business? "Your" english is not as good and there's a mess with the visa I presume...
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bob808
just to answer your q :

can you stay on the opt while being unemployed?

yes you can stick around for a year after your llm and use it to find a job - but the only problem is that it can be quite hard to leave the us and be allowed in reentry on the opt if you dont have a job as immigration officers will tend to ask for a letter from your employer when you get back to the us. and as you said, it's pretty pricey staying on esp in a city like ny
just to answer your q :

can you stay on the opt while being unemployed?

yes you can stick around for a year after your llm and use it to find a job - but the only problem is that it can be quite hard to leave the us and be allowed in reentry on the opt if you dont have a job as immigration officers will tend to ask for a letter from your employer when you get back to the us. and as you said, it's pretty pricey staying on esp in a city like ny
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Dumdedum
Thanks, I was wondering the same thing... so you get 2 months with the F1, and then the OPT for another 12 months ? Interesting... all these visa/immigration problems will surely be on our minds all the time I guess.
Thanks, I was wondering the same thing... so you get 2 months with the F1, and then the OPT for another 12 months ? Interesting... all these visa/immigration problems will surely be on our minds all the time I guess.
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bob808
nriattorney's post makes it sound like you need to clear the bar exam first before looking for a job
to be clear - that is absolutely NOT the case
you need to begin your job search as soon as you arrive
firms will generally assume that you're able to pass the bar and most good firms will pay for your bar expenses - just make it clear when you apply that you intend to sit for the bar exam in july
in fact you would generally start work (around sept.) before bar results come out
already having the bar is going to make very little difference to your job search
nriattorney's post makes it sound like you need to clear the bar exam first before looking for a job
to be clear - that is absolutely NOT the case
you need to begin your job search as soon as you arrive
firms will generally assume that you're able to pass the bar and most good firms will pay for your bar expenses - just make it clear when you apply that you intend to sit for the bar exam in july
in fact you would generally start work (around sept.) before bar results come out
already having the bar is going to make very little difference to your job search
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Mr Easter
So no one care for non-legal positions in consulting, IBs and corporations?
So no one care for non-legal positions in consulting, IBs and corporations?
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hannenyh
once you are a licenced attorney, there is absolutely no dearth of work.

A friend (LL.M from CWRU) told me that by working for one year post-LL.M, he was able to recover all the expense incurred on LL.M.

therefore, nothing to worry about a job after LL.M and there is no need to make alternative career plans only for this fear.


This seems to be extremely optimistic. Take it from someone who has seen plenty of LLMs fail in their efforts of securing a well paying job. Even after they passed the NY bar exam. But hey, hope is what makes us survive right ;)
<blockquote>once you are a licenced attorney, there is absolutely no dearth of work.

A friend (LL.M from CWRU) told me that by working for one year post-LL.M, he was able to recover all the expense incurred on LL.M.

therefore, nothing to worry about a job after LL.M and there is no need to make alternative career plans only for this fear. </blockquote>

This seems to be extremely optimistic. Take it from someone who has seen plenty of LLMs fail in their efforts of securing a well paying job. Even after they passed the NY bar exam. But hey, hope is what makes us survive right ;)

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