I want to apply next year. Which LLM is superior, UK or US?
How would you rate Harvard, CLS and NYU v. Oxford, Cambridge and LSE?
Looking forward to your inputs.
Top Tier American Law Schools v Top Tier UK Law Schools
Posted Apr 08, 2009 05:36
0
I want to apply next year. Which LLM is superior, UK or US?
How would you rate Harvard, CLS and NYU v. Oxford, Cambridge and LSE?
Looking forward to your inputs.
How would you rate Harvard, CLS and NYU v. Oxford, Cambridge and LSE?
Looking forward to your inputs.
Posted Apr 09, 2009 15:36
0
Harvard
Oxford
Cambridge
Columbia
LSE
Harvard
Oxford
Cambridge
Columbia
LSE
Oxford
Cambridge
Columbia
LSE
Posted Apr 09, 2009 17:24
0
NYU??
NYU??
Posted Apr 13, 2009 14:54
0
Oxford
Harvard
Cambridge
NYU
Columbia
LSE
but again, it really much depends on the sphere of your own interests, as each of the schools you have choosen is better in one and worse in another.
Oxford
Harvard
Cambridge
NYU
Columbia
LSE
but again, it really much depends on the sphere of your own interests, as each of the schools you have choosen is better in one and worse in another.
Harvard
Cambridge
NYU
Columbia
LSE
but again, it really much depends on the sphere of your own interests, as each of the schools you have choosen is better in one and worse in another.
Posted Apr 13, 2009 15:45
0
In the field of Corporate and Commercial Laws....?
In the field of Corporate and Commercial Laws....?
Posted Apr 13, 2009 15:53
0
Harvard
NYU/Columbia
Cambridge
Oxford
LSE
Harvard
NYU/Columbia
Cambridge
Oxford
LSE
NYU/Columbia
Cambridge
Oxford
LSE
Posted May 02, 2009 12:45
0
Hey,
Can u also rank them for IPR??
Thanks
Hey,
Can u also rank them for IPR??
Thanks
Can u also rank them for IPR??
Thanks
Posted May 02, 2009 13:25
0
Harvard
Columbia
NYU
Cambridge
Oxford
LSE
Regards,
Harvard
Columbia
NYU
Cambridge
Oxford
LSE
Regards,
Columbia
NYU
Cambridge
Oxford
LSE
Regards,
Posted May 02, 2009 15:05
0
It all depends on the courses. For example, this ranking would be upside down if one was looking at Human Rights, LSE has the best Human Rights Faculty in the UK. Oxford is by far the best so far as Jurisprudence is concerned NYU is the place for Jurisprudence in the US). Harvard is superb for IP and Internet Laws and for comparative constitutional Law. Camrbridge has the best IP programme in the UK. LSE has an excellent for corporate and commercial laws and also taxation (better than Oxbridge). Cambridge is great for it's International Law and same is the case with NYU. In the US NYU has the best taxation programme, in the UK it's LSE. Kings College has the best competition law programme in the UK. Columbia is generally very good and so is Chicago.
So it's really hard to rank these schools, if you get into any one of Harvard, Columbia, NYU, Chicago, OXbridge or LSE, in my opinion you are guaranteed quality education. One would then look at quality of life and other factors to make up one's mind. Also, US is the place to go if one wants work in the US or the UK. UK LLM does not help for an entry into the UK legal market. US LLM's have a direct entry, whereas as a UK LLM student you will need to take up the training contract.
As such the Harvard LLM and the Oxford BCL are the best programmes in the world. Otherwise, there is little to choose between the other colleges.
My overall general ranking would be:
Harvard
Oxford
Cambridge/Columbia
LSE
NYU
Chicago
It all depends on the courses. For example, this ranking would be upside down if one was looking at Human Rights, LSE has the best Human Rights Faculty in the UK. Oxford is by far the best so far as Jurisprudence is concerned NYU is the place for Jurisprudence in the US). Harvard is superb for IP and Internet Laws and for comparative constitutional Law. Camrbridge has the best IP programme in the UK. LSE has an excellent for corporate and commercial laws and also taxation (better than Oxbridge). Cambridge is great for it's International Law and same is the case with NYU. In the US NYU has the best taxation programme, in the UK it's LSE. Kings College has the best competition law programme in the UK. Columbia is generally very good and so is Chicago.
So it's really hard to rank these schools, if you get into any one of Harvard, Columbia, NYU, Chicago, OXbridge or LSE, in my opinion you are guaranteed quality education. One would then look at quality of life and other factors to make up one's mind. Also, US is the place to go if one wants work in the US or the UK. UK LLM does not help for an entry into the UK legal market. US LLM's have a direct entry, whereas as a UK LLM student you will need to take up the training contract.
As such the Harvard LLM and the Oxford BCL are the best programmes in the world. Otherwise, there is little to choose between the other colleges.
My overall general ranking would be:
Harvard
Oxford
Cambridge/Columbia
LSE
NYU
Chicago
So it's really hard to rank these schools, if you get into any one of Harvard, Columbia, NYU, Chicago, OXbridge or LSE, in my opinion you are guaranteed quality education. One would then look at quality of life and other factors to make up one's mind. Also, US is the place to go if one wants work in the US or the UK. UK LLM does not help for an entry into the UK legal market. US LLM's have a direct entry, whereas as a UK LLM student you will need to take up the training contract.
As such the Harvard LLM and the Oxford BCL are the best programmes in the world. Otherwise, there is little to choose between the other colleges.
My overall general ranking would be:
Harvard
Oxford
Cambridge/Columbia
LSE
NYU
Chicago
Posted May 02, 2009 17:24
0
Thanks for that very interesting post. How do you know all that detail!? Any idea of how the ranking goes for criminal? And where does Berkely or Princeton fit in the the US?
Thanks for that very interesting post. How do you know all that detail!? Any idea of how the ranking goes for criminal? And where does Berkely or Princeton fit in the the US?
Posted May 02, 2009 18:00
0
So it's really hard to rank these schools, if you get into any one of Harvard, Columbia, NYU, Chicago, OXbridge or LSE, in my opinion you are guaranteed quality education. One would then look at quality of life and other factors to make up one's mind...As such the Harvard LLM and the Oxford BCL are the best programmes in the world. Otherwise, there is little to choose between the other colleges.
I agree with most of your post. However, I disagree that the Harvard LLM and Oxford BCL are the best in the world. From an American perspective (and I believe if you asked most American legal academics, they would agree), Yale's LLM far outpaces either Harvard or Oxford. Many American academics would also rate Cambridge's LLM equal to Oxford's BCL. Harvard's LLM is not nearly as well respected in the US as its JD program.
<blockquote>So it's really hard to rank these schools, if you get into any one of Harvard, Columbia, NYU, Chicago, OXbridge or LSE, in my opinion you are guaranteed quality education. One would then look at quality of life and other factors to make up one's mind...As such the Harvard LLM and the Oxford BCL are the best programmes in the world. Otherwise, there is little to choose between the other colleges.</blockquote>
I agree with most of your post. However, I disagree that the Harvard LLM and Oxford BCL are the best in the world. From an American perspective (and I believe if you asked most American legal academics, they would agree), Yale's LLM far outpaces either Harvard or Oxford. Many American academics would also rate Cambridge's LLM equal to Oxford's BCL. Harvard's LLM is not nearly as well respected in the US as its JD program.
I agree with most of your post. However, I disagree that the Harvard LLM and Oxford BCL are the best in the world. From an American perspective (and I believe if you asked most American legal academics, they would agree), Yale's LLM far outpaces either Harvard or Oxford. Many American academics would also rate Cambridge's LLM equal to Oxford's BCL. Harvard's LLM is not nearly as well respected in the US as its JD program.
Posted May 02, 2009 19:54
0
@ Jeremy Bentham, Just did a lot of research on all the programmes, in detail. Sorry, criminal law is not my subject and I don't know much about it. But more or less the top schools from either jurisdictions have been mentioned on this thread, and like I've said before, all of them will ensure quality education.
@LawyerinUSA- Sorry, since the Yale LLM is largely for the academia, I did not include it, I did not inlude Stanford either (Although it has a very limited LLM in terms of subjects, it is also very well recognised). Both programmes are excellent. Both admit extremely selective students and Yale certainly tops the table.
So far as Oxford BCL is concerned, I think it's a lot more rigorous compared to any other LLM in the UK- and can be compared only to the top 1-2 schools from the US in that regard. In fact there is not much to choose from a Cam or an LSE LLM (Both are known for certain subjects)but Cam is a better brand.
The other advantage of the UK LLM is that it is a lot cheaper than a US LLM. It's good for people who want to learn and go back to their country. A lot of factors to consider :D
I am glad that you agreed with most of my post.
@ Jeremy Bentham, Just did a lot of research on all the programmes, in detail. Sorry, criminal law is not my subject and I don't know much about it. But more or less the top schools from either jurisdictions have been mentioned on this thread, and like I've said before, all of them will ensure quality education.
@LawyerinUSA- Sorry, since the Yale LLM is largely for the academia, I did not include it, I did not inlude Stanford either (Although it has a very limited LLM in terms of subjects, it is also very well recognised). Both programmes are excellent. Both admit extremely selective students and Yale certainly tops the table.
So far as Oxford BCL is concerned, I think it's a lot more rigorous compared to any other LLM in the UK- and can be compared only to the top 1-2 schools from the US in that regard. In fact there is not much to choose from a Cam or an LSE LLM (Both are known for certain subjects)but Cam is a better brand.
The other advantage of the UK LLM is that it is a lot cheaper than a US LLM. It's good for people who want to learn and go back to their country. A lot of factors to consider :D
I am glad that you agreed with most of my post.
@LawyerinUSA- Sorry, since the Yale LLM is largely for the academia, I did not include it, I did not inlude Stanford either (Although it has a very limited LLM in terms of subjects, it is also very well recognised). Both programmes are excellent. Both admit extremely selective students and Yale certainly tops the table.
So far as Oxford BCL is concerned, I think it's a lot more rigorous compared to any other LLM in the UK- and can be compared only to the top 1-2 schools from the US in that regard. In fact there is not much to choose from a Cam or an LSE LLM (Both are known for certain subjects)but Cam is a better brand.
The other advantage of the UK LLM is that it is a lot cheaper than a US LLM. It's good for people who want to learn and go back to their country. A lot of factors to consider :D
I am glad that you agreed with most of my post.
Posted May 02, 2009 22:23
0
The other advantage of the UK LLM is that it is a lot cheaper than a US LLM. It's good for people who want to learn and go back to their country. A lot of factors to consider
Absolutely!
I do think that Oxon and Cantab are considered equivalent to Harvard/Yale, in terms of brand name and reputation in the US. Both are held in awe. LSE is a wonderful school (my cousin, who is also American, attended LSE), but it would not be considered in the same league as Oxbridge, nor would American legal scholars consider it to be of the caliber as Chicago, Stanford, Columbia, etc. Interestingly, I spoke a couple of months ago to a well-respected American legal scholar about UK law schools; although he lauded both Cambridge and Oxford, he said he had "never heard of" the LSE law program. Several other law professors have told me the same thing. It seems that LSE has an image problem in the US (i.e., a minimal image). Shows the importance of branding!!
<blockquote>The other advantage of the UK LLM is that it is a lot cheaper than a US LLM. It's good for people who want to learn and go back to their country. A lot of factors to consider </blockquote>
Absolutely!
I do think that Oxon and Cantab are considered equivalent to Harvard/Yale, in terms of brand name and reputation in the US. Both are held in awe. LSE is a wonderful school (my cousin, who is also American, attended LSE), but it would not be considered in the same league as Oxbridge, nor would American legal scholars consider it to be of the caliber as Chicago, Stanford, Columbia, etc. Interestingly, I spoke a couple of months ago to a well-respected American legal scholar about UK law schools; although he lauded both Cambridge and Oxford, he said he had "never heard of" the LSE law program. Several other law professors have told me the same thing. It seems that LSE has an image problem in the US (i.e., a minimal image). Shows the importance of branding!!
Absolutely!
I do think that Oxon and Cantab are considered equivalent to Harvard/Yale, in terms of brand name and reputation in the US. Both are held in awe. LSE is a wonderful school (my cousin, who is also American, attended LSE), but it would not be considered in the same league as Oxbridge, nor would American legal scholars consider it to be of the caliber as Chicago, Stanford, Columbia, etc. Interestingly, I spoke a couple of months ago to a well-respected American legal scholar about UK law schools; although he lauded both Cambridge and Oxford, he said he had "never heard of" the LSE law program. Several other law professors have told me the same thing. It seems that LSE has an image problem in the US (i.e., a minimal image). Shows the importance of branding!!
Posted May 02, 2009 23:16
0
You know while I find that really strange, the fact regarding the American Legal Scholar, as such I am not surprised, because largely these things are matters of awareness. For example, when I told a a "legal scholar" as you have put it that I've got into Columbia, he asked me whether it was a South American Country and asked me why would I want to go there! When I told my friends (not from the legal fraternity) that I got into NYU, everyone was very happy, but not because of the school as such but because it was NY! Whereas across the board, the reactions that I have got for getting an offer from LSE have been very heartening.
In my country, India very few people about the Chicago Law School or NYU for that matter. Although a lot of them know about Columbia (as I said, some legal scholars don't know what what is!) that's because it's Ivy League. NYU is known strictly in the legal circles for it's law school. As a University, NYU is just ordinary otherwise.
When it comes to people who really matter, everyone will tell you that all these schools are top notch and capable of giving quality education and one must then go by which place/school suits them the most.
Though I still think that Oxford, Harvard, Yale and Stanford are in a separate league.
You know while I find that really strange, the fact regarding the American Legal Scholar, as such I am not surprised, because largely these things are matters of awareness. For example, when I told a a "legal scholar" as you have put it that I've got into Columbia, he asked me whether it was a South American Country and asked me why would I want to go there! When I told my friends (not from the legal fraternity) that I got into NYU, everyone was very happy, but not because of the school as such but because it was NY! Whereas across the board, the reactions that I have got for getting an offer from LSE have been very heartening.
In my country, India very few people about the Chicago Law School or NYU for that matter. Although a lot of them know about Columbia (as I said, some legal scholars don't know what what is!) that's because it's Ivy League. NYU is known strictly in the legal circles for it's law school. As a University, NYU is just ordinary otherwise.
When it comes to people who really matter, everyone will tell you that all these schools are top notch and capable of giving quality education and one must then go by which place/school suits them the most.
Though I still think that Oxford, Harvard, Yale and Stanford are in a separate league.
In my country, India very few people about the Chicago Law School or NYU for that matter. Although a lot of them know about Columbia (as I said, some legal scholars don't know what what is!) that's because it's Ivy League. NYU is known strictly in the legal circles for it's law school. As a University, NYU is just ordinary otherwise.
When it comes to people who really matter, everyone will tell you that all these schools are top notch and capable of giving quality education and one must then go by which place/school suits them the most.
Though I still think that Oxford, Harvard, Yale and Stanford are in a separate league.
Posted May 02, 2009 23:25
0
Another very important fact to be taken into consideration is the intake of students and the academic requirements of getting into these schools. Once again Harvard, Yale and the 3 UK Schools will lay heavy emphasis on academic achievements. Whereas NYU and Columbia will look at the "overall" achievements. In the top 3 UK Law Schools generally students are at least amongst the top 10% of class as opposed to NYU and Columbia (I know people who have studied at these schools who were not that academically strong) where one can compensate lack of academic achievements with work experience.
Another very important fact to be taken into consideration is the intake of students and the academic requirements of getting into these schools. Once again Harvard, Yale and the 3 UK Schools will lay heavy emphasis on academic achievements. Whereas NYU and Columbia will look at the "overall" achievements. In the top 3 UK Law Schools generally students are at least amongst the top 10% of class as opposed to NYU and Columbia (I know people who have studied at these schools who were not that academically strong) where one can compensate lack of academic achievements with work experience.
Posted May 03, 2009 22:53
0
You know while I find that really strange, the fact regarding the American Legal Scholar, as such I am not surprised, because largely these things are matters of awareness. For example, when I told a a "legal scholar" as you have put it that I've got into Columbia, he asked me whether it was a South American Country and asked me why would I want to go there!....
Though I still think that Oxford, Harvard, Yale and Stanford are in a separate league.
You gave me a good laugh about the Columbia reaction. Americans associate the South American Republic of Columbia with drug cartels (although that association is outdated by a decade, and the country is truly beautiful).
I suspect most people, regardless of nationality, know Yale, Harvard, Oxford, and Cambridge. Each of these four has established and cemented an elite brand (Oxford and Cambridge for hundreds of years!!!). Stanford is newer on the scene, and within the US, it's probably viewed on the same level as Columbia and Chicago, both of which are great schools. It seems that more legal powerhouses come from Columbia and Chicago than from Stanford. Regardless, I would not mind living in Palo Alto...perhaps the perfect climate...
Most importantly, as you noted, most top-notch law schools are capable of giving quality education, and, in the end, it ultimately comes down to the best fit for the person.
<blockquote>You know while I find that really strange, the fact regarding the American Legal Scholar, as such I am not surprised, because largely these things are matters of awareness. For example, when I told a a "legal scholar" as you have put it that I've got into Columbia, he asked me whether it was a South American Country and asked me why would I want to go there!....
Though I still think that Oxford, Harvard, Yale and Stanford are in a separate league.
</blockquote>
You gave me a good laugh about the Columbia reaction. Americans associate the South American Republic of Columbia with drug cartels (although that association is outdated by a decade, and the country is truly beautiful).
I suspect most people, regardless of nationality, know Yale, Harvard, Oxford, and Cambridge. Each of these four has established and cemented an elite brand (Oxford and Cambridge for hundreds of years!!!). Stanford is newer on the scene, and within the US, it's probably viewed on the same level as Columbia and Chicago, both of which are great schools. It seems that more legal powerhouses come from Columbia and Chicago than from Stanford. Regardless, I would not mind living in Palo Alto...perhaps the perfect climate...
Most importantly, as you noted, most top-notch law schools are capable of giving quality education, and, in the end, it ultimately comes down to the best fit for the person.
Though I still think that Oxford, Harvard, Yale and Stanford are in a separate league.
</blockquote>
You gave me a good laugh about the Columbia reaction. Americans associate the South American Republic of Columbia with drug cartels (although that association is outdated by a decade, and the country is truly beautiful).
I suspect most people, regardless of nationality, know Yale, Harvard, Oxford, and Cambridge. Each of these four has established and cemented an elite brand (Oxford and Cambridge for hundreds of years!!!). Stanford is newer on the scene, and within the US, it's probably viewed on the same level as Columbia and Chicago, both of which are great schools. It seems that more legal powerhouses come from Columbia and Chicago than from Stanford. Regardless, I would not mind living in Palo Alto...perhaps the perfect climate...
Most importantly, as you noted, most top-notch law schools are capable of giving quality education, and, in the end, it ultimately comes down to the best fit for the person.
Posted May 04, 2009 00:41
0
I could not have a good laugh when I was met with that reaction, I was all excited about getting into Columbia and his reaction was a complete dampener! Absolutely, at the end it comes down to the best for for the person as all these schools would impart great education.
I could not have a good laugh when I was met with that reaction, I was all excited about getting into Columbia and his reaction was a complete dampener! Absolutely, at the end it comes down to the best for for the person as all these schools would impart great education.
Posted May 04, 2009 09:34
0
I am an American.
Don't forget: America doesn't offer an LLM without a JD. In our system, you must first become a lawyer and then study law. Which is a bit like saying that you must first become a philosopher and then study philosophy--it's a pants-on-head-retarded statement. I personally wish to study law without becoming a lawyer or a paralegal. I believe in the words "oversight" and "function," two things missing from the American legal system and our practices with other nations. Under this rationale, and with this set of circumstances, I would rank the best law programs as such:
Harvard
Oxford
LSE
Yale
King's
Queen Mary
In terms of LLM colleges:
Oxford (best in the world. period. end of story.)
LSE (near oxford. a close second best.)
King's (alike LSE, less reputable.)
Queen Mary (it's Queen Mary.)
Harvard (obviously)
Berkley (for the 20 week international student program)
NYU (wide range of programs, like LSE)
Stanford (just awesome)
Pierce (humble and damn good)
-
-
-
Yale (reputable but arrogant and disliked--don't put your money on its reputation, my generation loathes Yale)
Then UPenn, Dartmouth, Georgetown, assembled American bullsh*t.
-B
I am an American.
Don't forget: America doesn't offer an LLM without a JD. In our system, you must first become a lawyer and then study law. Which is a bit like saying that you must first become a philosopher and then study philosophy--it's a pants-on-head-retarded statement. I personally wish to study law without becoming a lawyer or a paralegal. I believe in the words "oversight" and "function," two things missing from the American legal system and our practices with other nations. Under this rationale, and with this set of circumstances, I would rank the best law programs as such:
Harvard
Oxford
LSE
Yale
King's
Queen Mary
In terms of LLM colleges:
Oxford (best in the world. period. end of story.)
LSE (near oxford. a close second best.)
King's (alike LSE, less reputable.)
Queen Mary (it's Queen Mary.)
Harvard (obviously)
Berkley (for the 20 week international student program)
NYU (wide range of programs, like LSE)
Stanford (just awesome)
Pierce (humble and damn good)
-
-
-
Yale (reputable but arrogant and disliked--don't put your money on its reputation, my generation loathes Yale)
Then UPenn, Dartmouth, Georgetown, assembled American bullsh*t.
-B
Don't forget: America doesn't offer an LLM without a JD. In our system, you must first become a lawyer and then study law. Which is a bit like saying that you must first become a philosopher and then study philosophy--it's a pants-on-head-retarded statement. I personally wish to study law without becoming a lawyer or a paralegal. I believe in the words "oversight" and "function," two things missing from the American legal system and our practices with other nations. Under this rationale, and with this set of circumstances, I would rank the best law programs as such:
Harvard
Oxford
LSE
Yale
King's
Queen Mary
In terms of LLM colleges:
Oxford (best in the world. period. end of story.)
LSE (near oxford. a close second best.)
King's (alike LSE, less reputable.)
Queen Mary (it's Queen Mary.)
Harvard (obviously)
Berkley (for the 20 week international student program)
NYU (wide range of programs, like LSE)
Stanford (just awesome)
Pierce (humble and damn good)
-
-
-
Yale (reputable but arrogant and disliked--don't put your money on its reputation, my generation loathes Yale)
Then UPenn, Dartmouth, Georgetown, assembled American bullsh*t.
-B
Posted May 04, 2009 12:11
0
@ Benji What happens to Columbia, NYU and Chicago? Where's Cam? I don't think Kings and Queen Mary can be compared to Oxbridge and LSE or any top school in America. They are not in that league, imo.
@ Benji What happens to Columbia, NYU and Chicago? Where's Cam? I don't think Kings and Queen Mary can be compared to Oxbridge and LSE or any top school in America. They are not in that league, imo.
Posted May 04, 2009 15:46
0
@ Benji What happens to Columbia, NYU and Chicago? Where's Cam?
Benji appears to have produced an "alternative" ranking of law schools. I disagree with it, but that's ok. The absence of Chicago from Benji's list is intriguing, considering that Chicago is known as perhaps the most intellectual university in the world. It is very difficult to gain admission to the undergrad and grad programs at Chicago (much tougher than Harvard, Oxford, and LSE, for example, where people with good but not great academic credentials are admited to dozens of programs). Also, I do not know why Benji loathes Yale. But I doubt many law school applicants (either at the LLM or JD level) would scorn Yale because of its arrogance.
<blockquote>@ Benji What happens to Columbia, NYU and Chicago? Where's Cam? </blockquote>
Benji appears to have produced an "alternative" ranking of law schools. I disagree with it, but that's ok. The absence of Chicago from Benji's list is intriguing, considering that Chicago is known as perhaps the most intellectual university in the world. It is very difficult to gain admission to the undergrad and grad programs at Chicago (much tougher than Harvard, Oxford, and LSE, for example, where people with good but not great academic credentials are admited to dozens of programs). Also, I do not know why Benji loathes Yale. But I doubt many law school applicants (either at the LLM or JD level) would scorn Yale because of its arrogance.
Benji appears to have produced an "alternative" ranking of law schools. I disagree with it, but that's ok. The absence of Chicago from Benji's list is intriguing, considering that Chicago is known as perhaps the most intellectual university in the world. It is very difficult to gain admission to the undergrad and grad programs at Chicago (much tougher than Harvard, Oxford, and LSE, for example, where people with good but not great academic credentials are admited to dozens of programs). Also, I do not know why Benji loathes Yale. But I doubt many law school applicants (either at the LLM or JD level) would scorn Yale because of its arrogance.
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