The reputation of Assas


To all foreign students: be careful while reading the posts above. The reality is: the two best law schools in France are Sorbonne and Assas. None is better than the other, they each have the same level, although each can be better in some specific programs. Period. The problem with Assas is, as described above, that Assas students have a complex about studying in their university because they realize that Assas is absolutely unknow anywhere else in France. Plus, when you look at the partnership program of Assas, it is truly inferior compared to Sorbonne. The Sorbonne has numerous partnerships with excellent universities abroad (including all the American Ivy League universities) while Assas cannot compare to it and has a truly poor international program. Sorbonne is such an excellent university that all students not studying there have a complex about it and just try to always say that their university is the best. The truth is: Sorbonne is politically left, Assas politically right / Sorbonne culturally diverse, Assas 99% white. If you are brilliant, enjoy studying in an international context, if you wish to study in one the top 2 law universities in France, and also have the opportunity to study in an excellent university, say an American Ivy League university: go to Sorbonne. This is signed by an Assas student.
To all foreign students: be careful while reading the posts above. The reality is: the two best law schools in France are Sorbonne and Assas. None is better than the other, they each have the same level, although each can be better in some specific programs. Period. The problem with Assas is, as described above, that Assas students have a complex about studying in their university because they realize that Assas is absolutely unknow anywhere else in France. Plus, when you look at the partnership program of Assas, it is truly inferior compared to Sorbonne. The Sorbonne has numerous partnerships with excellent universities abroad (including all the American Ivy League universities) while Assas cannot compare to it and has a truly poor international program. Sorbonne is such an excellent university that all students not studying there have a complex about it and just try to always say that their university is the best. The truth is: Sorbonne is politically left, Assas politically right / Sorbonne culturally diverse, Assas 99% white. If you are brilliant, enjoy studying in an international context, if you wish to study in one the top 2 law universities in France, and also have the opportunity to study in an excellent university, say an American Ivy League university: go to Sorbonne. This is signed by an Assas student.
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Everybody agree with you Catherine-1 :
- i f you want to work abroad, go to La Sorbonne. Because it has a great reputation
- if you want to work in France, go to Assas, because the level is the best

Compagnies know that, and even if an American will say that he knows La Sorbonne but not Assas, Assas stay the best law university in France. Actually the second one is Aix University, and the third is La Sorbonne.
When I choose my law university, I had 2 evidents choices. La Sorbonne or Assas. A guy who works in the French ministery of National Education told me : What do you want to do later ? I answer I don't know, maybe work abroad in a world wide institution as an administrator. And he said, well you have to do your 5th years (Master 2) in La Sorbonne. But to get accepted easely you have to have a very good law level, to do that, I think that the best way is to do your 4th first years in Assas and have good grades. Then, you have the garantee to go to La Sorbonne.
Why did he say that ? Well, simple. To be accepted in La Sorbonne, a grade of 12/20 in a good university like Assas is enough. To be accepted in Assas in Master 2, a grade a 13 or 14/20 is necessary. And sometimes, not enough. For example, Master of Assas of Business of law : 850 people applied, 40 sustained. La Sorbonne can't clam the same.

Then the guy told me, don't you want to be a judge, or a magistrate ? Well, I answer why not ! I am 17, I don't really know what I really want to do. And he said, if you want to be judge or magistrate, stay in Assas. Why ? Because the contest of ENM (national school in France which products magistrates) shows that the majority of students who succeed the contest, comes from assas. Every year the statistiques show that almost 50% of students from Assas succeed the contest, 30% from Bordeaux and juste 10% for La Sorbonne.
In 2006, 186 students accepted, 76 comes from Assas and the rest comes from others university.
In 2007 139 students accepted, 41 comes from Assas and the rest comes from others university.
in 2008, 88 students accepted, 22 comes from Assas and the rest comes from others university.
In 2009 80 students accepted, 35 comes from Assas and the rest comes from others university.
In 2010, 86 students accepted, 30 comes from Assas and the rest comes from others university.

Reality of numbers... But I think we all agree with the fact that if you go abroad with a master of law from La Sorbonne, you have more chance to be recruted, because of reputation. And, that's what I would do... After my 4th years, I will try to be accepted in la Sorbonne.


NB : About the post of Catherine1 who said that Assas is very liberal (right) and la sorbonne is socialist (left). Yes it's true... so what ? =_="
And I precise that Assas is liberal (true) but, for the American politics, a french liberal is a good socialist. And a french socialist is a good communist. Well don't be scared... >_
Everybody agree with you Catherine-1 :
- i f you want to work abroad, go to La Sorbonne. Because it has a great reputation
- if you want to work in France, go to Assas, because the level is the best

Compagnies know that, and even if an American will say that he knows La Sorbonne but not Assas, Assas stay the best law university in France. Actually the second one is Aix University, and the third is La Sorbonne.
When I choose my law university, I had 2 evidents choices. La Sorbonne or Assas. A guy who works in the French ministery of National Education told me : What do you want to do later ? I answer I don't know, maybe work abroad in a world wide institution as an administrator. And he said, well you have to do your 5th years (Master 2) in La Sorbonne. But to get accepted easely you have to have a very good law level, to do that, I think that the best way is to do your 4th first years in Assas and have good grades. Then, you have the garantee to go to La Sorbonne.
Why did he say that ? Well, simple. To be accepted in La Sorbonne, a grade of 12/20 in a good university like Assas is enough. To be accepted in Assas in Master 2, a grade a 13 or 14/20 is necessary. And sometimes, not enough. For example, Master of Assas of Business of law : 850 people applied, 40 sustained. La Sorbonne can't clam the same.

Then the guy told me, don't you want to be a judge, or a magistrate ? Well, I answer why not ! I am 17, I don't really know what I really want to do. And he said, if you want to be judge or magistrate, stay in Assas. Why ? Because the contest of ENM (national school in France which products magistrates) shows that the majority of students who succeed the contest, comes from assas. Every year the statistiques show that almost 50% of students from Assas succeed the contest, 30% from Bordeaux and juste 10% for La Sorbonne.
In 2006, 186 students accepted, 76 comes from Assas and the rest comes from others university.
In 2007 139 students accepted, 41 comes from Assas and the rest comes from others university.
in 2008, 88 students accepted, 22 comes from Assas and the rest comes from others university.
In 2009 80 students accepted, 35 comes from Assas and the rest comes from others university.
In 2010, 86 students accepted, 30 comes from Assas and the rest comes from others university.

Reality of numbers... But I think we all agree with the fact that if you go abroad with a master of law from La Sorbonne, you have more chance to be recruted, because of reputation. And, that's what I would do... After my 4th years, I will try to be accepted in la Sorbonne.


NB : About the post of Catherine1 who said that Assas is very liberal (right) and la sorbonne is socialist (left). Yes it's true... so what ? =_="
And I precise that Assas is liberal (true) but, for the American politics, a french liberal is a good socialist. And a french socialist is a good communist. Well don't be scared... >_
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Adriana: Assas is the best law school in SOME programs, and Sorbonne is the best law school in SOME programs. None is better than the other, they are both at the same level and both very good in their respective programs, and it is impossible to compare which is better than the other anyway. A person working in a ministry is not a universal reference. It all depends on what you want to do, and we both agree on that :) There is no official ranking nor a unanimous agreement on which is better than the other. And about the political differences: Assas students think that because their university is far-right, they are more strict, and because Sorbonne is culturally diverse, they are not as strict. It is racist and stupid but this is what is commonly believed.
Adriana: Assas is the best law school in SOME programs, and Sorbonne is the best law school in SOME programs. None is better than the other, they are both at the same level and both very good in their respective programs, and it is impossible to compare which is better than the other anyway. A person working in a ministry is not a universal reference. It all depends on what you want to do, and we both agree on that :) There is no official ranking nor a unanimous agreement on which is better than the other. And about the political differences: Assas students think that because their university is far-right, they are more strict, and because Sorbonne is culturally diverse, they are not as strict. It is racist and stupid but this is what is commonly believed.
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louison
Adriana: Assas is the best law school in SOME programs, and Sorbonne is the best law school in SOME programs. None is better than the other, they are both at the same level and both very good in their respective programs, and it is impossible to compare which is better than the other anyway. A person working in a ministry is not a universal reference. It all depends on what you want to do, and we both agree on that :) There is no official ranking nor a unanimous agreement on which is better than the other. And about the political differences: Assas students think that because their university is far-right, they are more strict, and because Sorbonne is culturally diverse, they are not as strict. It is racist and stupid but this is what is commonly believed.


la Sorbonne, known abroad ?

American people imagine that Sorbonne is only one university. They know the name but they don't care about the university Paris 1 Panthéon Sorbonne. American universities & recruiters know Assas as well as Sorbonne.

For example, 5 french people go to Harvard each year : 3 of Assas (precisely from the Magistère Juriste d'Affaires directed by the professor Michel Germain, the most respected Business Law professor in France), one of la Sorbonne and one of ScPo.


There are lot of evidence which show that Assas is slightly better

https://www.sullcrom.com/ataglance/?view=schools
http://www.shearman.com/offices/detail.aspx?office=d7697253-bd5a-4c44-8432-00dbf42609d2&page=lawyers
http://www.bredinprat.fr/2-8110-ASSOCIES.php

The large majority of lawyers in the bast LawFirms come from Assas.

Just give me ONE famous law firm in which one there are more students from Sorbonne. You won't find because it doesn't exist. And in French Companies, the gap is even more wide. I have 1 year of experience in the legal department of a CAC40 company : everybody was coming from Assas. Nobody from the Sorbonne.

And for the partnership : Assas have partnership with Oxford, UCL, King's College and the INSEAD. Whereas Sorbonne has just a good partnership with Columbia. That's all.

There is an official ranking of the Masters degree
http://www.meilleurs-masters.com/master-droit-des-affaires.html?PHPSESSID=d2ca69f190d9c24984d1366545bf296c

But where is la Sorbonne ?!

It is known that the M2 degree in Business Law of Assas is better that the one of la Sorbonne. The same for the M2's in General Private Law, criminal Law, Labour Law, taxation etc...

And concerning the rest of your post ("assas is racist"). It is as stupid to say that. As to say that Sorbonne is always in strike and full of cannabis smokers.
<blockquote>Adriana: Assas is the best law school in SOME programs, and Sorbonne is the best law school in SOME programs. None is better than the other, they are both at the same level and both very good in their respective programs, and it is impossible to compare which is better than the other anyway. A person working in a ministry is not a universal reference. It all depends on what you want to do, and we both agree on that :) There is no official ranking nor a unanimous agreement on which is better than the other. And about the political differences: Assas students think that because their university is far-right, they are more strict, and because Sorbonne is culturally diverse, they are not as strict. It is racist and stupid but this is what is commonly believed. </blockquote>

la Sorbonne, known abroad ?

American people imagine that Sorbonne is only one university. They know the name but they don't care about the university Paris 1 Panthéon Sorbonne. American universities & recruiters know Assas as well as Sorbonne.

For example, 5 french people go to Harvard each year : 3 of Assas (precisely from the Magistère Juriste d'Affaires directed by the professor Michel Germain, the most respected Business Law professor in France), one of la Sorbonne and one of ScPo.


There are lot of evidence which show that Assas is slightly better

https://www.sullcrom.com/ataglance/?view=schools
http://www.shearman.com/offices/detail.aspx?office=d7697253-bd5a-4c44-8432-00dbf42609d2&page=lawyers
http://www.bredinprat.fr/2-8110-ASSOCIES.php

The large majority of lawyers in the bast LawFirms come from Assas.

Just give me ONE famous law firm in which one there are more students from Sorbonne. You won't find because it doesn't exist. And in French Companies, the gap is even more wide. I have 1 year of experience in the legal department of a CAC40 company : everybody was coming from Assas. Nobody from the Sorbonne.

And for the partnership : Assas have partnership with Oxford, UCL, King's College and the INSEAD. Whereas Sorbonne has just a good partnership with Columbia. That's all.

There is an official ranking of the Masters degree
http://www.meilleurs-masters.com/master-droit-des-affaires.html?PHPSESSID=d2ca69f190d9c24984d1366545bf296c

But where is la Sorbonne ?!

It is known that the M2 degree in Business Law of Assas is better that the one of la Sorbonne. The same for the M2's in General Private Law, criminal Law, Labour Law, taxation etc...

And concerning the rest of your post ("assas is racist"). It is as stupid to say that. As to say that Sorbonne is always in strike and full of cannabis smokers.
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If what you say is true, then why would you spend SO much energy and time to try to prove it? Assas students will always come with new and long arguments to try to prove that their university is better. But if this was the case, then why would you be so irritated and agressive when trying to prove it? If Assas was such a good university as you say it, it would be internationally renowned and you would not need to prove it that hard. When I say to anyone that I studied at the Sorbonne (having studied at both Sorbonne and Assas), I don't need to explain what is my university: everybody already knows it is an excellent university. And Sorbonne has exchange programs with other universities than Columbia - you do not seem to be well informed at all. Sorbonne is the only French university where you can both have a French diploma of law and an american JD from Colmbia or Cornell. For instance. And that is not only one example. "It is known", "look at this website", bla bla bla... not official proofs. And I never said Assas was racist, I just said that it was not international at all and only French students with no international background and zero knowledge of foreign languages go there. People who mostly have never travelled and only know French and France.You will never see as many foreign students in Assas than at the Sorbonne, which is a true international university.
If what you say is true, then why would you spend SO much energy and time to try to prove it? Assas students will always come with new and long arguments to try to prove that their university is better. But if this was the case, then why would you be so irritated and agressive when trying to prove it? If Assas was such a good university as you say it, it would be internationally renowned and you would not need to prove it that hard. When I say to anyone that I studied at the Sorbonne (having studied at both Sorbonne and Assas), I don't need to explain what is my university: everybody already knows it is an excellent university. And Sorbonne has exchange programs with other universities than Columbia - you do not seem to be well informed at all. Sorbonne is the only French university where you can both have a French diploma of law and an american JD from Colmbia or Cornell. For instance. And that is not only one example. "It is known", "look at this website", bla bla bla... not official proofs. And I never said Assas was racist, I just said that it was not international at all and only French students with no international background and zero knowledge of foreign languages go there. People who mostly have never travelled and only know French and France.You will never see as many foreign students in Assas than at the Sorbonne, which is a true international university.
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If what you say is true, then why would you spend SO much energy and time to try to prove it? Assas students will always come with new and long arguments to try to prove that their university is better. But if this was the case, then why would you be so irritated and agressive when trying to prove it? If Assas was such a good university as you say it, it would be internationally renowned and you would not need to prove it that hard. When I say to anyone that I studied at the Sorbonne (having studied at both Sorbonne and Assas), I don't need to explain what is my university: everybody already knows it is an excellent university. And Sorbonne has exchange programs with other universities than Columbia - you do not seem to be well informed at all. Sorbonne is the only French university where you can both have a French diploma of law and an american JD from Colmbia or Cornell. For instance. And that is not only one example. "It is known", "look at this website", bla bla bla... not official proofs. And I never said Assas was racist, I just said that it was not international at all and only French students with no international background and zero knowledge of foreign languages go there. People who mostly have never travelled and only know French and France.You will never see as many foreign students in Assas than at the Sorbonne, which is a true international university.



If what you say is true, then why would you spend SO much energy and time to try to prove that La Sorbonne is better than Assas, Catherine1 ? U_U hum hum...

If La Sorbonne is famous abroad, it's because it is one of the first college in the world. Assas exists for decades but La Sorbonne for centuries. Why Harvard is better known abroad than Yale ? Because Harvard exists before Yale. Everything here is a matter of reputation. La Sorbonne is an historical figure, but assas is too much young to have its own story.

Objectively we cannot deny classifications, what ever if they are public or not. Often, classifications show, Assas swipes the first places.

And don't forget, Assas is a university specialized in the law while La Sorbonne is general. It is said that La Sorbonne is the best in history and geography... u_u Unanimously

Assas tries gradually to give way thanks to the autonomy of universities. Henceforth the financing of compagnies, will allow the universities to spread. Of course, Assas is in the front line, especially because the dean of Assas is in the head of all the universities by election.
<blockquote>If what you say is true, then why would you spend SO much energy and time to try to prove it? Assas students will always come with new and long arguments to try to prove that their university is better. But if this was the case, then why would you be so irritated and agressive when trying to prove it? If Assas was such a good university as you say it, it would be internationally renowned and you would not need to prove it that hard. When I say to anyone that I studied at the Sorbonne (having studied at both Sorbonne and Assas), I don't need to explain what is my university: everybody already knows it is an excellent university. And Sorbonne has exchange programs with other universities than Columbia - you do not seem to be well informed at all. Sorbonne is the only French university where you can both have a French diploma of law and an american JD from Colmbia or Cornell. For instance. And that is not only one example. "It is known", "look at this website", bla bla bla... not official proofs. And I never said Assas was racist, I just said that it was not international at all and only French students with no international background and zero knowledge of foreign languages go there. People who mostly have never travelled and only know French and France.You will never see as many foreign students in Assas than at the Sorbonne, which is a true international university.</blockquote>


If what you say is true, then why would you spend SO much energy and time to try to prove that La Sorbonne is better than Assas, Catherine1 ? U_U hum hum...

If La Sorbonne is famous abroad, it's because it is one of the first college in the world. Assas exists for decades but La Sorbonne for centuries. Why Harvard is better known abroad than Yale ? Because Harvard exists before Yale. Everything here is a matter of reputation. La Sorbonne is an historical figure, but assas is too much young to have its own story.

Objectively we cannot deny classifications, what ever if they are public or not. Often, classifications show, Assas swipes the first places.

And don't forget, Assas is a university specialized in the law while La Sorbonne is general. It is said that La Sorbonne is the best in history and geography... u_u Unanimously

Assas tries gradually to give way thanks to the autonomy of universities. Henceforth the financing of compagnies, will allow the universities to spread. Of course, Assas is in the front line, especially because the dean of Assas is in the head of all the universities by election.
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louison
If what you say is true, then why would you spend SO much energy and time to try to prove it? Assas students will always come with new and long arguments to try to prove that their university is better. But if this was the case, then why would you be so irritated and agressive when trying to prove it? If Assas was such a good university as you say it, it would be internationally renowned and you would not need to prove it that hard. When I say to anyone that I studied at the Sorbonne (having studied at both Sorbonne and Assas), I don't need to explain what is my university: everybody already knows it is an excellent university. And Sorbonne has exchange programs with other universities than Columbia - you do not seem to be well informed at all. Sorbonne is the only French university where you can both have a French diploma of law and an american JD from Colmbia or Cornell. For instance. And that is not only one example. "It is known", "look at this website", bla bla bla... not official proofs. And I never said Assas was racist, I just said that it was not international at all and only French students with no international background and zero knowledge of foreign languages go there. People who mostly have never travelled and only know French and France.You will never see as many foreign students in Assas than at the Sorbonne, which is a true international university.


The first part of your post is completely irrelevant. I am defending Assas as you're defending Sorbonne. So thank's in advance to spare me that kind of stupid argument :)

For the rest : I gave you some evidence wich "can be interpreted as showing that Assas is slightly better than Sorbonne" if U want to work in France.

And I'm still waiting yours.

Now, I ask U two questions :

1 - give me just one law firm where sorbonne is more represented than Assas

2 - give me just one master 2 degree from Sorbonne which is better than its equivalent from Assas.

I am listening U......

And for the Sorbonne which is a "real international university" hahaha. A world class institution. lol.
I've never heard something so funny. You have never been to the Centre Panthéon to say something like that...
HEC or SciencesPo are real international colleges. Not Assas, neither Sorbonne.

I use to be a nice guy. But when I read so many bullshits...

@ Adriana : the University Paris 1 Panthéon Sorbonne exists since 1968, like Assas.

To telle the truth : "la Sorbonne" is not one university any more but THREE universities : Paris 1, Paris 3 and Paris 4. And all the 13 Universities of Paris have the right to use the name "Sorbonne" (there have been a trial for that).

The real heiress of the old Faculty of Law of Paris is ..... Assas. Proof ? All the former professors of the old Faculty of paris now are former teacher of Assas (Malaurie, Malinvaud, Terré, Foyer, Cornu etc...)

My 2 c
<blockquote>If what you say is true, then why would you spend SO much energy and time to try to prove it? Assas students will always come with new and long arguments to try to prove that their university is better. But if this was the case, then why would you be so irritated and agressive when trying to prove it? If Assas was such a good university as you say it, it would be internationally renowned and you would not need to prove it that hard. When I say to anyone that I studied at the Sorbonne (having studied at both Sorbonne and Assas), I don't need to explain what is my university: everybody already knows it is an excellent university. And Sorbonne has exchange programs with other universities than Columbia - you do not seem to be well informed at all. Sorbonne is the only French university where you can both have a French diploma of law and an american JD from Colmbia or Cornell. For instance. And that is not only one example. "It is known", "look at this website", bla bla bla... not official proofs. And I never said Assas was racist, I just said that it was not international at all and only French students with no international background and zero knowledge of foreign languages go there. People who mostly have never travelled and only know French and France.You will never see as many foreign students in Assas than at the Sorbonne, which is a true international university.</blockquote>

The first part of your post is completely irrelevant. I am defending Assas as you're defending Sorbonne. So thank's in advance to spare me that kind of stupid argument :)

For the rest : I gave you some evidence wich "can be interpreted as showing that Assas is slightly better than Sorbonne" if U want to work in France.

And I'm still waiting yours.

Now, I ask U two questions :

1 - give me just one law firm where sorbonne is more represented than Assas

2 - give me just one master 2 degree from Sorbonne which is better than its equivalent from Assas.

I am listening U......

And for the Sorbonne which is a "real international university" hahaha. A world class institution. lol.
I've never heard something so funny. You have never been to the Centre Panthéon to say something like that...
HEC or SciencesPo are real international colleges. Not Assas, neither Sorbonne.

I use to be a nice guy. But when I read so many bullshits...

@ Adriana : the University Paris 1 Panthéon Sorbonne exists since 1968, like Assas.

To telle the truth : "la Sorbonne" is not one university any more but THREE universities : Paris 1, Paris 3 and Paris 4. And all the 13 Universities of Paris have the right to use the name "Sorbonne" (there have been a trial for that).

The real heiress of the old Faculty of Law of Paris is ..... Assas. Proof ? All the former professors of the old Faculty of paris now are former teacher of Assas (Malaurie, Malinvaud, Terré, Foyer, Cornu etc...)

My 2 c
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Thank you for proving to all the readers of these posts what I've been trying to explain here through my own posts: the fact that Assas is not as prestigious as Sorbonne makes Assas students agressive and feel inferior. And for your arguments: I truly hope they make you feel better and I truly hope that you will find many more that will help you cope with the fact that you're studying at Assas, a university that nobody knows abroad and that everybody puts at a same level as Sorbonne in France. You could not have been more helpful! Thanks!
Thank you for proving to all the readers of these posts what I've been trying to explain here through my own posts: the fact that Assas is not as prestigious as Sorbonne makes Assas students agressive and feel inferior. And for your arguments: I truly hope they make you feel better and I truly hope that you will find many more that will help you cope with the fact that you're studying at Assas, a university that nobody knows abroad and that everybody puts at a same level as Sorbonne in France. You could not have been more helpful! Thanks!
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louison
Thank you for proving to all the readers of these posts what I've been trying to explain here through my own posts: the fact that Assas is not as prestigious as Sorbonne makes Assas students agressive and feel inferior. And for your arguments: I truly hope they make you feel better and I truly hope that you will find many more that will help you cope with the fact that you're studying at Assas, a university that nobody knows abroad and that everybody puts at a same level as Sorbonne in France. You could not have been more helpful! Thanks!

So if Sorbonne is as prestigious as you say, how do you explain that Assas students have better results to the ENM ? And better professionel integration ?! And master degrees more selective ?!

Come back when you will have evidence, something else than "you're not nice" or "you have an inferiority complex" (thx for that joke, I've laughed a lot)

Good luck for the rest of your studies and if I can give you an advice : be prudent with the prestige of the name Sorbonne. It will be completely useless during an hiring interview (when you will be in competition with Assas/HEC/ScPo students)

Bests
<blockquote>Thank you for proving to all the readers of these posts what I've been trying to explain here through my own posts: the fact that Assas is not as prestigious as Sorbonne makes Assas students agressive and feel inferior. And for your arguments: I truly hope they make you feel better and I truly hope that you will find many more that will help you cope with the fact that you're studying at Assas, a university that nobody knows abroad and that everybody puts at a same level as Sorbonne in France. You could not have been more helpful! Thanks!</blockquote>
So if Sorbonne is as prestigious as you say, how do you explain that Assas students have better results to the ENM ? And better professionel integration ?! And master degrees more selective ?!

Come back when you will have evidence, something else than "you're not nice" or "you have an inferiority complex" (thx for that joke, I've laughed a lot)

Good luck for the rest of your studies and if I can give you an advice : be prudent with the prestige of the name Sorbonne. It will be completely useless during an hiring interview (when you will be in competition with Assas/HEC/ScPo students)

Bests
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<blockquote>
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To be completely honest (because from what I can read from you, you are obviously still a student whereas I have been working for more than 3 years now in a CAC40 company), the university you studied at is completely irrelevant once you start working. It will be solely your experience and profile that will matter. I've seen many students from Assas being rejected from my company for internships or jobs, due to the fact that their profile was not original enough, or had poor knowledge of foreign languages, etc. Whereas others from less prestigious universities were selected because they had more interesting profiles. Oh and it is mostly Assas students who told me that the level was not as high as people may think. This is my last post, good luck! And no, I won't waste my time trying to bring evidence, I don't need to do it coming from Sorbonne.
To be completely honest (because from what I can read from you, you are obviously still a student whereas I have been working for more than 3 years now in a CAC40 company), the university you studied at is completely irrelevant once you start working. It will be solely your experience and profile that will matter. I've seen many students from Assas being rejected from my company for internships or jobs, due to the fact that their profile was not original enough, or had poor knowledge of foreign languages, etc. Whereas others from less prestigious universities were selected because they had more interesting profiles. Oh and it is mostly Assas students who told me that the level was not as high as people may think. This is my last post, good luck! And no, I won't waste my time trying to bring evidence, I don't need to do it coming from Sorbonne.
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louison
And no, I won't waste my time trying to bring evidence,

That's what I call a "Sorbonne demonstration".

If you want to learn how to argue
http://whomurderedrobertwone.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/law-for-dummies1.jpg

:)
<blockquote>And no, I won't waste my time trying to bring evidence, </blockquote>
That's what I call a "Sorbonne demonstration".

If you want to learn how to argue
http://whomurderedrobertwone.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/law-for-dummies1.jpg

:)
quote
Pierre_PP
Hi,I had the same question some months ago.I am in my senior year of my maitrise at the University of Vienna and by now I have my exchange year at Paris 2.According to all French rankings ,Assas is said to be the successor of what we called "Sorbonne",unfortunately since 1968 there is no real Sorbonne anymore,but the three "Sorbonnes" -Paris 1,3 and 4.Meanwhile the Universities of Assas, Paris 4 and Paris 6 have created their own group called "Sorbonne Universites".The level in Assas is in fact very high,however the approaches there are much more academic and not practical ones. In terms of the conditions for studying,Assas is a real disaster,even worse than Eastern Europe where I come from-there are never places in the libraries,lack of book and commentaries, especially a lack of computers,of printers etc,people sitting on the floor because of the lack of chairs and tables... In fact with regard to international rankings such as QS or Times High Education,Assas as well as Paris 1 are ranked as being middle class universities in Europe,in contrast to Louvain or Geneva proposing in fact excellent conditions...
I find the majority of professors are quit good professionals and the classes are very interesting.However,the approach seems to be this of the 1920s when we had to learn everything by heard, to write down each word and than to write all that dissertations which you will never have to use in practice in stead of having cases like in Germany,Austria or Switzerland.There are no power point presentations as well as no relevant books for the exam, in fact there is a lack of books for writing down your thesis or your memoire and being ill even for 1 day is a catastrophe because you couldn't notice every professor's word.
On the other hand,we have to take into account Assas reputation in the spheres of research and some interesting programs such as those with Oxford,King's and UCL or even Singapore as well as its reputation among employers on the continent.Once I was admitted at Assas and Paris 1.however the letters of admission were late.In fact,the administration there is more then horrible for there is no notification even per email or on the homepage that certain professors shall absent which is not very kind especially if you live in the banlieu and if you have to spend an hour in order to reach the city.I suppose that this is a an approach being a patent of Assas for there are no problems like that in Sciences Po or HEC or even Paris 5...In fact,once I was really disappointed because of my admission being late and my financial problems,on the other hand I joined an other quit prestigious university especially in terms of international law,however with a much more practical and modern approach in terms of teaching and administration.
As to Paris 1,this university proposes an excellent programs with the UK and the US and has a quit good reputation in France and in Europe at all.As to the conditions of studying especially in terms of whether there is a library or if they are enough computers there,I have not heard anything...In regard to Paris 4 or Paris 3,I could agree that there is a kind of a "Sorbonne demonstration" especially with regard to law schools (and the rumors as well as all international rankings are quit negative).
Hi,I had the same question some months ago.I am in my senior year of my maitrise at the University of Vienna and by now I have my exchange year at Paris 2.According to all French rankings ,Assas is said to be the successor of what we called "Sorbonne",unfortunately since 1968 there is no real Sorbonne anymore,but the three "Sorbonnes" -Paris 1,3 and 4.Meanwhile the Universities of Assas, Paris 4 and Paris 6 have created their own group called "Sorbonne Universites".The level in Assas is in fact very high,however the approaches there are much more academic and not practical ones. In terms of the conditions for studying,Assas is a real disaster,even worse than Eastern Europe where I come from-there are never places in the libraries,lack of book and commentaries, especially a lack of computers,of printers etc,people sitting on the floor because of the lack of chairs and tables... In fact with regard to international rankings such as QS or Times High Education,Assas as well as Paris 1 are ranked as being middle class universities in Europe,in contrast to Louvain or Geneva proposing in fact excellent conditions...
I find the majority of professors are quit good professionals and the classes are very interesting.However,the approach seems to be this of the 1920s when we had to learn everything by heard, to write down each word and than to write all that dissertations which you will never have to use in practice in stead of having cases like in Germany,Austria or Switzerland.There are no power point presentations as well as no relevant books for the exam, in fact there is a lack of books for writing down your thesis or your memoire and being ill even for 1 day is a catastrophe because you couldn't notice every professor's word.
On the other hand,we have to take into account Assas reputation in the spheres of research and some interesting programs such as those with Oxford,King's and UCL or even Singapore as well as its reputation among employers on the continent.Once I was admitted at Assas and Paris 1.however the letters of admission were late.In fact,the administration there is more then horrible for there is no notification even per email or on the homepage that certain professors shall absent which is not very kind especially if you live in the banlieu and if you have to spend an hour in order to reach the city.I suppose that this is a an approach being a patent of Assas for there are no problems like that in Sciences Po or HEC or even Paris 5...In fact,once I was really disappointed because of my admission being late and my financial problems,on the other hand I joined an other quit prestigious university especially in terms of international law,however with a much more practical and modern approach in terms of teaching and administration.
As to Paris 1,this university proposes an excellent programs with the UK and the US and has a quit good reputation in France and in Europe at all.As to the conditions of studying especially in terms of whether there is a library or if they are enough computers there,I have not heard anything...In regard to Paris 4 or Paris 3,I could agree that there is a kind of a "Sorbonne demonstration" especially with regard to law schools (and the rumors as well as all international rankings are quit negative).
quote
Pierre_PP
Actually,I cannot understand all that scandals around the reputations of law schools.In fact,not the mere reputation but the quality (and the diversity of your profiles) are said to be decisive.Let's just let law firms and international institutions decide.Without doubt,there is nothing like what we call "academic liberty",all that law schools are said to be conservative in terms of having elective courses or supplementary studies,in contrast to US,UK and Central Europe.In fact,it is important to pay attention on your supplementary knowledge and your skills and experience instead of the name of the university.In Austria people demand diversity in education and having lawyers with diverse specializations instead of having law graduates manufacture and that's why they just refuse introducing the LLB...just let professional experience shows and be neutral.
Actually,I cannot understand all that scandals around the reputations of law schools.In fact,not the mere reputation but the quality (and the diversity of your profiles) are said to be decisive.Let's just let law firms and international institutions decide.Without doubt,there is nothing like what we call "academic liberty",all that law schools are said to be conservative in terms of having elective courses or supplementary studies,in contrast to US,UK and Central Europe.In fact,it is important to pay attention on your supplementary knowledge and your skills and experience instead of the name of the university.In Austria people demand diversity in education and having lawyers with diverse specializations instead of having law graduates manufacture and that's why they just refuse introducing the LLB...just let professional experience shows and be neutral.
quote
louison
Hey !!!

Your post point out several problems :

- for the conditions of work : welcome in the french universities !!! Seriously, I agree to say there is a problem with the universities in France but, trust me, Assas is not the worst. Go see Tolbiac or Jussieu or even the Centre Panthéon (which is shared by Assas and Sorbonne), You will see the center Assas as a palace. :D

You study in the centre Panthéon or in the centre Assas ?! Because the centre Assas is quite good as compared to the other universities (except Dauphine). The library is new, there are computers, and the classrooms have just been restored.

There is a major problem in French Universities : the money !!! The French State has not enough money for faculties. In France, the budget for a student in law is at 9000euro against 15000euro for Sweden or 20000euros for the U.S. :(

For example, Assas has 138 millions euros for 18000 students. Paris 1 Sorbonne has 117 million euros for 39 255 students.

- for the approach of the courses : it is how you learn French Law. You have to sit and to listen and you will speak when you'll be in Master 2. It is widely different than the commonlaw system.

You say that the German or English system are better because you study case. But It's impossible to learn French law studying case. France is not a case law system !!! It is a written law system : you have to spend at least 4 years to understand the concepts and the theories and then you will be ready for study cases. But it is a non sense to start with cases. It is how the Sciences Po law school works but it is not possible in French Law.

I spent a year in exchange at UCL and, to tell the truth, I was very surprised to see that students learnt solutions, solutions and solutions. But they never learn reasonings.

And to finish with the rankings between Assas and Sorbonne, I would say that Sorbonne is slightly better for international law, and Assas is slightly better for private and business law. Science po has a very good reputation over all for Public affairs and International affairs. Not for law.
Hey !!!

Your post point out several problems :

- for the conditions of work : welcome in the french universities !!! Seriously, I agree to say there is a problem with the universities in France but, trust me, Assas is not the worst. Go see Tolbiac or Jussieu or even the Centre Panthéon (which is shared by Assas and Sorbonne), You will see the center Assas as a palace. :D

You study in the centre Panthéon or in the centre Assas ?! Because the centre Assas is quite good as compared to the other universities (except Dauphine). The library is new, there are computers, and the classrooms have just been restored.

There is a major problem in French Universities : the money !!! The French State has not enough money for faculties. In France, the budget for a student in law is at 9000euro against 15000euro for Sweden or 20000euros for the U.S. :(

For example, Assas has 138 millions euros for 18000 students. Paris 1 Sorbonne has 117 million euros for 39 255 students.

- for the approach of the courses : it is how you learn French Law. You have to sit and to listen and you will speak when you'll be in Master 2. It is widely different than the commonlaw system.

You say that the German or English system are better because you study case. But It's impossible to learn French law studying case. France is not a case law system !!! It is a written law system : you have to spend at least 4 years to understand the concepts and the theories and then you will be ready for study cases. But it is a non sense to start with cases. It is how the Sciences Po law school works but it is not possible in French Law.

I spent a year in exchange at UCL and, to tell the truth, I was very surprised to see that students learnt solutions, solutions and solutions. But they never learn reasonings.

And to finish with the rankings between Assas and Sorbonne, I would say that Sorbonne is slightly better for international law, and Assas is slightly better for private and business law. Science po has a very good reputation over all for Public affairs and International affairs. Not for law.
quote
andresob5
I agree with louison, the difference between common law and civil law systems makes it very difficult to compare legal education in the UK/USA and France.
I agree with louison, the difference between common law and civil law systems makes it very difficult to compare legal education in the UK/USA and France.
quote
Kingston
As far as national reputation is concerned Assas is indeed the best of public universitites, but Sorbonne is also great. Sorbonne is the only one to have an international reputation.

However, don't underestimate Sciences Po Law School for both national and international reputation, as it was created in 2009 and is growing everyday. I am a student there. Just look at the partnerships we have around the world, and next year a new one with Harvard is coming. Also, nationally it's highly prestigious and makes it easier to find internships and jobs.
As far as national reputation is concerned Assas is indeed the best of public universitites, but Sorbonne is also great. Sorbonne is the only one to have an international reputation.

However, don't underestimate Sciences Po Law School for both national and international reputation, as it was created in 2009 and is growing everyday. I am a student there. Just look at the partnerships we have around the world, and next year a new one with Harvard is coming. Also, nationally it's highly prestigious and makes it easier to find internships and jobs.
quote
Pierre_PP
Hi,in fact the library at the Centre Assas is quit new and nice as well as the rooms,however,there are is a real lack in terms of equipement and books and even of a cafe or a restaurant or of places to seat and to get your coffee.As to Germany and Austria,it is codified law,Austria was the first in Central Europe to codify its law in the form of its ABGB (1811),but what I mean is in fact having theoretical cases like in maths which we have to solve and to discuss,however there is a certain influence of the jurisprudence over law itself as well as some discrepancies between doctrine and the Supreme Court.In fact am Bulgarian and Belgian so that there is no nationalistical element in terms of mz considerations,but I have been always thinking of France spending lots of money in education and science.For exemple Switzerland spends more than 1 billion francs per year only for the ETH Zurich (Ecole Polytechnique de Zurich),Geneva and the EPFL receive as well many sponsorships .But I agree that Assas is considered as being better as the "Sorbonne",in fact in terms of law schools Assas is said to be the heir of the Sorbonne and not Paris 1 or Paris 4...As to Sciences Po it has a really excellent reputation even though its ranking is not so good perhaps because of the lack of money,but I suppose it is better for politics and diplomacy and so specialized in law.In fact I adore France and Paris,but I got a little bit disappointed by the lack of academical freedom and of equipment ...
Hi,in fact the library at the Centre Assas is quit new and nice as well as the rooms,however,there are is a real lack in terms of equipement and books and even of a cafe or a restaurant or of places to seat and to get your coffee.As to Germany and Austria,it is codified law,Austria was the first in Central Europe to codify its law in the form of its ABGB (1811),but what I mean is in fact having theoretical cases like in maths which we have to solve and to discuss,however there is a certain influence of the jurisprudence over law itself as well as some discrepancies between doctrine and the Supreme Court.In fact am Bulgarian and Belgian so that there is no nationalistical element in terms of mz considerations,but I have been always thinking of France spending lots of money in education and science.For exemple Switzerland spends more than 1 billion francs per year only for the ETH Zurich (Ecole Polytechnique de Zurich),Geneva and the EPFL receive as well many sponsorships .But I agree that Assas is considered as being better as the "Sorbonne",in fact in terms of law schools Assas is said to be the heir of the Sorbonne and not Paris 1 or Paris 4...As to Sciences Po it has a really excellent reputation even though its ranking is not so good perhaps because of the lack of money,but I suppose it is better for politics and diplomacy and so specialized in law.In fact I adore France and Paris,but I got a little bit disappointed by the lack of academical freedom and of equipment ...
quote
louison

However, don't underestimate Sciences Po Law School for both national and international reputation, as it was created in 2009 and is growing everyday. I am a student there. Just look at the partnerships we have around the world, and next year a new one with Harvard is coming. Also, nationally it's highly prestigious and makes it easier to find internships and jobs.

Hey !!!

I am the first to say that Sciences Po has a very good level for Public Affairs and International Relations. But, for private Law, I would say that Assas & Sorbonne are better.

Sciences Po has not the quantity of professor. Assas and Sorbonne have the best professors in France.

Students from Sc Po always apply to masters 2 of Assas in Private & Business Law after graduating. And the masters 2 in Business law from Assas are more selective than ScPo, indeed with the new process of selection in ScPo (only with files, not with an exam any more)

for the partnership : It is not a real partnership with Harvard. You don't receive degree at the end. With UPenn & Georgetown : you have to pay 35000dollars, so It is not as interesting as the partnership of the Sorbonne (where you pay the Sorbonne fees).

And for the jobs : students from the top master 2 of Assas find jobs and internship very easily. I know a lot of students in economic law at ScPo and the network in law firms is not as developped as the one of Assas or even Sorbonne.

I think than ScPo has a role to play and is an alternative to the little war Assas/Sorbonne. But It is not enough good in private law to be a serious competitor.

And I don't even speak of the research activity of Sciences Po which doesn't exists (5 students in Phd in Law) as compared to those of Assas (200 students in Phd in law) and Sorbonne (about 150).
<blockquote>
However, don't underestimate Sciences Po Law School for both national and international reputation, as it was created in 2009 and is growing everyday. I am a student there. Just look at the partnerships we have around the world, and next year a new one with Harvard is coming. Also, nationally it's highly prestigious and makes it easier to find internships and jobs. </blockquote>
Hey !!!

I am the first to say that Sciences Po has a very good level for Public Affairs and International Relations. But, for private Law, I would say that Assas & Sorbonne are better.

Sciences Po has not the quantity of professor. Assas and Sorbonne have the best professors in France.

Students from Sc Po always apply to masters 2 of Assas in Private & Business Law after graduating. And the masters 2 in Business law from Assas are more selective than ScPo, indeed with the new process of selection in ScPo (only with files, not with an exam any more)

for the partnership : It is not a real partnership with Harvard. You don't receive degree at the end. With UPenn & Georgetown : you have to pay 35000dollars, so It is not as interesting as the partnership of the Sorbonne (where you pay the Sorbonne fees).

And for the jobs : students from the top master 2 of Assas find jobs and internship very easily. I know a lot of students in economic law at ScPo and the network in law firms is not as developped as the one of Assas or even Sorbonne.

I think than ScPo has a role to play and is an alternative to the little war Assas/Sorbonne. But It is not enough good in private law to be a serious competitor.

And I don't even speak of the research activity of Sciences Po which doesn't exists (5 students in Phd in Law) as compared to those of Assas (200 students in Phd in law) and Sorbonne (about 150).
quote
EdP
And the clencher in the "Assas" vs "Sorbonne" debate:

The French government started an initiative to boost its best universities. In particular, 5.5 billion euros are to be divided between the top 5 "centers of excellence".

Assas (Paris II) was chosen as one of them (under the grouping "Sorbonne Universites" see http://www.sorbonne-universites.fr/), while "Sorbonne" (Paris I under the grouping "HESAM" see http://www.hesam.eu/) was not.

So with roughly a billion euro boost (to be shared with the other three principal members of Paris Universites), Assas will undoubtedly pull ahead.

If you are wondering why they all use "Sorbonne" in their name, it is because all 13 Paris universities have the right to do so (including "Assas"), as Paris I "Pantheon-Sorbonne" reminded "Paris Universites": http://www.univ-paris1.fr/universite/espace-presse/evenements-et-communiques-de-presse/communique-du-rectorat-sur-le-pres-2-4-6/

Frankly, given how "Sorbonne" (Paris I) students abuse the name, I have zero sympathy.
And the clencher in the "Assas" vs "Sorbonne" debate:

The French government started an initiative to boost its best universities. In particular, 5.5 billion euros are to be divided between the top 5 "centers of excellence".

Assas (Paris II) was chosen as one of them (under the grouping "Sorbonne Universites" see http://www.sorbonne-universites.fr/), while "Sorbonne" (Paris I under the grouping "HESAM" see http://www.hesam.eu/) was not.

So with roughly a billion euro boost (to be shared with the other three principal members of Paris Universites), Assas will undoubtedly pull ahead.

If you are wondering why they all use "Sorbonne" in their name, it is because all 13 Paris universities have the right to do so (including "Assas"), as Paris I "Pantheon-Sorbonne" reminded "Paris Universites": http://www.univ-paris1.fr/universite/espace-presse/evenements-et-communiques-de-presse/communique-du-rectorat-sur-le-pres-2-4-6/

Frankly, given how "Sorbonne" (Paris I) students abuse the name, I have zero sympathy.
quote

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