Foreign lawyer in the US? You don't need LLM.


smartguy

Smartguy, thanks for your post. I was just wondering what had led you to the US while you're saying foreign attorneys can't be competitive without a JD.

P.S. Off-topic:My full support to your statements about the fact that the Russians have to learn a lot but this is still (or wil be) a great country.


Masha,
ICan I call you this way? :-)

The thing is that i will not compete with US attorneys. I will try to find my own niche in the market and i will compete with my self. Am i smart guy or what? :-)

<blockquote>Smartguy, thanks for your post. I was just wondering what had led you to the US while you're saying foreign attorneys can't be competitive without a JD.

P.S. Off-topic:My full support to your statements about the fact that the Russians have to learn a lot but this is still (or wil be) a great country.</blockquote>

Masha,
ICan I call you this way? :-)

The thing is that i will not compete with US attorneys. I will try to find my own niche in the market and i will compete with my self. Am i smart guy or what? :-)
quote
GML

Masha is perfect :))
I do not have other choice than calling you "smart guy". If it's not a "gostaina", what is the niche you are talking about (I promise not to steal your idea :))

Masha is perfect :))
I do not have other choice than calling you "smart guy". If it's not a "gostaina", what is the niche you are talking about (I promise not to steal your idea :))
quote
smartguy

Masha is perfect :))
I do not have other choice than calling you "smart guy". If it's not a "gostaina", what is the niche you are talking about (I promise not to steal your idea :))


Smartguy is fine to me :-)) Tolik is equally ok.
The niche is not clear now. I need to focus on bar exam. That's all i care for now. As we say in Hebrew: let's get to the bridge first....

<blockquote>Masha is perfect :))
I do not have other choice than calling you "smart guy". If it's not a "gostaina", what is the niche you are talking about (I promise not to steal your idea :))</blockquote>

Smartguy is fine to me :-)) Tolik is equally ok.
The niche is not clear now. I need to focus on bar exam. That's all i care for now. As we say in Hebrew: let's get to the bridge first....
quote
matreshka

Wasn't I missing Russians on this forum!!! And here they are, speaking about the uselessness of LL.M education on the site with a name "LL.M-Guide". I am sure that you will find a lot of alter egos here.

Molodtsa, Tolik!!! Tak ih vseh!!!

Wasn't I missing Russians on this forum!!! And here they are, speaking about the uselessness of LL.M education on the site with a name "LL.M-Guide". I am sure that you will find a lot of alter egos here.

Molodtsa, Tolik!!! Tak ih vseh!!!
quote
GML

Matreshka, nu nado j nam vydelitsia iz obschei massy.... Kak vse- neinteresno. Pravda, Tolik? :))

Matreshka, nu nado j nam vydelitsia iz obschei massy.... Kak vse- neinteresno. Pravda, Tolik? :))
quote
smartguy

Hey hey girls!
Don't forget about non-Russian message board members. I understand that we are all coming coming from the biggest country in the world and I am making a suicide act by promoting non-LLM rout to bar admission :-))) but let's respect our non-Russian speaking collegues and get back to professional discussion in English.
Damnl.. i sound like forum administrator now :-)

Hey hey girls!
Don't forget about non-Russian message board members. I understand that we are all coming coming from the biggest country in the world and I am making a suicide act by promoting non-LLM rout to bar admission :-))) but let's respect our non-Russian speaking collegues and get back to professional discussion in English.
Damnl.. i sound like forum administrator now :-)
quote
seculf

Hi Smartguy: For a foreign lawyer without a LLM in US, he can't take the NY Bar Exam, but can take the California's, is that right? How can i get information from the California Bar Exam, any recommendatory website? Thanks!

Hi Smartguy: For a foreign lawyer without a LLM in US, he can't take the NY Bar Exam, but can take the California's, is that right? How can i get information from the California Bar Exam, any recommendatory website? Thanks!
quote
Nikolas

http://www.calbar.ca.gov/state/calbar/calbar_generic.jsp?cid=10115 and http://www.calbar.ca.gov/calbar/pdfs/admissions/sf_legal-edu-outside-us.pdf

As a lawyer you will not have difficulties finding the relevant regulations :-)

Actually, if you do find them, please post them on this board, as I haven't...

http://www.calbar.ca.gov/state/calbar/calbar_generic.jsp?cid=10115 and http://www.calbar.ca.gov/calbar/pdfs/admissions/sf_legal-edu-outside-us.pdf

As a lawyer you will not have difficulties finding the relevant regulations :-)

Actually, if you do find them, please post them on this board, as I haven't...

quote
Nikolas

Actually I plan take the bar in New York, so I wasn't looking too thoroughly...

Actually I plan take the bar in New York, so I wasn't looking too thoroughly...
quote
smartguy

http://calbar.ca.gov/calbar/pdfs/admissions/77sf.pdf

CA Bar allows ALL foreign attorneys to take its Bar exam. NY allows to take its Bar exam only to those law graduate whose legal tranining durationally and substantially equals to JD and the country of legal education is based on principles of common law (e.g. if you hold 3 years law degree from UK, Canada, Australia, NZ, Israel) If your law degree only satisfies one of these two requirements (e.g. at least 3 years long) then welcome to LLM, my friend.

http://calbar.ca.gov/calbar/pdfs/admissions/77sf.pdf

CA Bar allows ALL foreign attorneys to take its Bar exam. NY allows to take its Bar exam only to those law graduate whose legal tranining durationally and substantially equals to JD and the country of legal education is based on principles of common law (e.g. if you hold 3 years law degree from UK, Canada, Australia, NZ, Israel) If your law degree only satisfies one of these two requirements (e.g. at least 3 years long) then welcome to LLM, my friend.
quote
Nikolas

Thanks, smartguy!

Thanks, smartguy!
quote
russian

this is very interesing info, smartguy.
i wonder how many of us are admitted in any jurisdiction?

this is very interesing info, smartguy.
i wonder how many of us are admitted in any jurisdiction?
quote
smartguy

this is very interesing info, smartguy.
i wonder how many of us are admitted in any jurisdiction?

Russian,
That i don't know. All i know specifically about Russia that many of my classmates are practicing law without being admitted to Russian Bar. Although it doesn't seem to be a problem to take Russian Bar exam. It should be a "piece of cake" for you if you think about taking Bar exam in America :-)

<blockquote>this is very interesing info, smartguy.
i wonder how many of us are admitted in any jurisdiction?
</blockquote>
Russian,
That i don't know. All i know specifically about Russia that many of my classmates are practicing law without being admitted to Russian Bar. Although it doesn't seem to be a problem to take Russian Bar exam. It should be a "piece of cake" for you if you think about taking Bar exam in America :-)
quote
Tommy

Still cant believe what http://calbar.ca.gov/calbar/pdfs/admissions/77sf.pdf is saying, although it does not specifically mention the common / roman law issue. That completely changes everything. So, the way to go would be to break the first obstacle in CA. and move on to other US jurisdictions as we' d see fit? Hell of a tactic, Id say.

Another question, there was an attorney from Louisiana that posted here sometime ago, but I just cant find his insertion. Would Smartguy know what the bar requirements at the blue napoleon code state (Louisiana) would be? I know LA. operates through codes of procedure - civil/roman based.

Nice going smartguy, I must admit it, you have overcome yourself!

"É o relatório"

Still cant believe what http://calbar.ca.gov/calbar/pdfs/admissions/77sf.pdf is saying, although it does not specifically mention the common / roman law issue. That completely changes everything. So, the way to go would be to break the first obstacle in CA. and move on to other US jurisdictions as we' d see fit? Hell of a tactic, Id say.

Another question, there was an attorney from Louisiana that posted here sometime ago, but I just cant find his insertion. Would Smartguy know what the bar requirements at the blue napoleon code state (Louisiana) would be? I know LA. operates through codes of procedure - civil/roman based.

Nice going smartguy, I must admit it, you have overcome yourself!

"É o relatório"
quote
Shumelka

I can answer this for smartguy.
I'm also a Russian attorney who considered a Louisiana LL.M some time ago. The director of an LL.M program told me that I can be admitted to practice law in Louisiana provided I'm a US permanent resident who obtained LL.M in LA.

As to your disbelief in California's opportunity, it's easy to prove smartguy's correctness. Check lawyers profiles in Lexis and you'll find lawyers from civil law jurisdictions admitted to practice law in CA. For instance, Olga Karasik, a Russian attorney passed Cal bar in 1994, but obtained her LL.M in 1996.

I can answer this for smartguy.
I'm also a Russian attorney who considered a Louisiana LL.M some time ago. The director of an LL.M program told me that I can be admitted to practice law in Louisiana provided I'm a US permanent resident who obtained LL.M in LA.

As to your disbelief in California's opportunity, it's easy to prove smartguy's correctness. Check lawyers profiles in Lexis and you'll find lawyers from civil law jurisdictions admitted to practice law in CA. For instance, Olga Karasik, a Russian attorney passed Cal bar in 1994, but obtained her LL.M in 1996.
quote
james

Please be advised, if you have a 3 year LLB from an English (common law) jurisdiciton ie. Canada, UK, Australia, NewZealand, you will qualify to sit the NY Bar WITHOUT the need for a US LLM.

Please be advised, if you have a 3 year LLB from an English (common law) jurisdiciton ie. Canada, UK, Australia, NewZealand, you will qualify to sit the NY Bar WITHOUT the need for a US LLM.
quote
olaf

All you smart guys...
Don't forget the hardest part is emigrating/getting a job.
Taking the bar is easy in comparison...

All you smart guys...
Don't forget the hardest part is emigrating/getting a job.
Taking the bar is easy in comparison...
quote
N Sharma

Hi, this is amazing information.
I am an Indian, with an LLB from India. Wish to know if this find from smart guy can REALLY allow me to take the NY Bar or the CA Bar.
Thanks

Hi, this is amazing information.
I am an Indian, with an LLB from India. Wish to know if this find from smart guy can REALLY allow me to take the NY Bar or the CA Bar.
Thanks
quote
smartguy

Hi, this is amazing information.
I am an Indian, with an LLB from India. Wish to know if this find from smart guy can REALLY allow me to take the NY Bar or the CA Bar.
Thanks

NY - may be, you'd have to submit your law diploma to NY Board of Law Examiners for evaluation. CA - for sure BUT only if you're admitted to practice law in India.

<blockquote>Hi, this is amazing information.
I am an Indian, with an LLB from India. Wish to know if this find from smart guy can REALLY allow me to take the NY Bar or the CA Bar.
Thanks</blockquote>
NY - may be, you'd have to submit your law diploma to NY Board of Law Examiners for evaluation. CA - for sure BUT only if you're admitted to practice law in India.
quote
kern

Hello everybody,

Congratulations and thank you to smart guy. His first posting is correct and very helpful.

In my personal job search experience in California passing the bar exam is not helpful for finding a lawyer job in good law firm. If they like you they will hire you anyway even without bar admission and ask you to pass the bar next time. The reason for that is procedure, procedure and again procedure. The big law firms follow strictly very formal procedure by hiring lawyers. No exceptions. They come in September in the law schools and interview only the top 20 % of the second year JD students. LL.M's are not in this group and are not interviewed. Then they offered them summer associate job for two months in the summer before the third year in the law school followed in most of the cases by job offer for the time after graduation and taking the bar exam.

So the bad news for the LL.M's is that LL.M and passing the bar do not guarantee any lawyer job in US. It will be smarter first to spot the job and then to pass the bar exam. You don't need LL.M. However if you have extra funds and one year, LL.M will be great experience, fun, studying and great new friends from all over the world.

Hello everybody,

Congratulations and thank you to smart guy. His first posting is correct and very helpful.

In my personal job search experience in California passing the bar exam is not helpful for finding a lawyer job in good law firm. If they like you they will hire you anyway even without bar admission and ask you to pass the bar next time. The reason for that is procedure, procedure and again procedure. The big law firms follow strictly very formal procedure by hiring lawyers. No exceptions. They come in September in the law schools and interview only the top 20 % of the second year JD students. LL.M's are not in this group and are not interviewed. Then they offered them summer associate job for two months in the summer before the third year in the law school followed in most of the cases by job offer for the time after graduation and taking the bar exam.

So the bad news for the LL.M's is that LL.M and passing the bar do not guarantee any lawyer job in US. It will be smarter first to spot the job and then to pass the bar exam. You don't need LL.M. However if you have extra funds and one year, LL.M will be great experience, fun, studying and great new friends from all over the world.
quote

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