Leiden PIL LLM GPA


Hello, I am sorry if this is a repeat question but I cannot seem to find the answer anywhere. What is the GPA needed for the regular Public International Law programme at Leiden University?

I am from Canada if this matters. Do they consider CGPA or possibly last few years?

Thank you in advance!
Hello, I am sorry if this is a repeat question but I cannot seem to find the answer anywhere. What is the GPA needed for the regular Public International Law programme at Leiden University?

I am from Canada if this matters. Do they consider CGPA or possibly last few years?

Thank you in advance!
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nsmesiai
Hey!

There's no GPA requirement. The decision is based on the overall assessment of your application, academic background, personal statement and reference.
Hey!

There's no GPA requirement. The decision is based on the overall assessment of your application, academic background, personal statement and reference.
quote
Thank you for the reply!

I have a follow up question for you. I am from Canada so this information is hard to find for me. Is Leiden Law School very difficult and competitive to get into? It's ranked quite high. I am used to seeing a GPA and LSAT score as the requirements for admission. Is there any known factors to work on in order to give myself an edge in Leiden's admission process (reeeeally hoping I can go there in the near future)?
Thank you for the reply!

I have a follow up question for you. I am from Canada so this information is hard to find for me. Is Leiden Law School very difficult and competitive to get into? It's ranked quite high. I am used to seeing a GPA and LSAT score as the requirements for admission. Is there any known factors to work on in order to give myself an edge in Leiden's admission process (reeeeally hoping I can go there in the near future)?
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nsmesiai
To be honest, I do not know how many applications they receive each year per programme. However, when I emailed them, they said that the amount of applications exceeds the amount of places they can offer, and thus it is necessary to compare each application based on their overall merits.

Personally, I highlighted some work experience, extracurricular activities and module choices to prove that I am passionate about the subject and have worked outside the academic curriculum to widen my knowledge about international law.
To be honest, I do not know how many applications they receive each year per programme. However, when I emailed them, they said that the amount of applications exceeds the amount of places they can offer, and thus it is necessary to compare each application based on their overall merits.

Personally, I highlighted some work experience, extracurricular activities and module choices to prove that I am passionate about the subject and have worked outside the academic curriculum to widen my knowledge about international law.
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Brainy Smu...
Requirements for the regular PIL programme:

http://en.mastersinleiden.nl/programmes/public-international-law-specialisation/en/entry-requirements

If you are serious about attending. Seriously consider - what will be gained by attending the aforementioned programme? Nevertheless, just apply. The sooner you get your documents in the faster you will be notified of a place. Remember: the early bird always gets the worm.

Note: PIL is not applicable outside of academia.
Requirements for the regular PIL programme:

http://en.mastersinleiden.nl/programmes/public-international-law-specialisation/en/entry-requirements

If you are serious about attending. Seriously consider - what will be gained by attending the aforementioned programme? Nevertheless, just apply. The sooner you get your documents in the faster you will be notified of a place. Remember: the early bird always gets the worm.

Note: PIL is not applicable outside of academia.
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Requirements for the regular PIL programme:

http://en.mastersinleiden.nl/programmes/public-international-law-specialisation/en/entry-requirements

If you are serious about attending. Seriously consider - what will be gained by attending the aforementioned programme? Nevertheless, just apply. The sooner you get your documents in the faster you will be notified of a place. Remember: the early bird always gets the worm.

Note: PIL is not applicable outside of academia.


Do you mean PIL as an LLM or that particular branch of law? Are other LLMs more valuable? I think for what I want to do an LLM in PIL is the best path (if I am to do an LLM, otherwise I'd stay in Canada and get a JD).
<blockquote>Requirements for the regular PIL programme:

http://en.mastersinleiden.nl/programmes/public-international-law-specialisation/en/entry-requirements

If you are serious about attending. Seriously consider - what will be gained by attending the aforementioned programme? Nevertheless, just apply. The sooner you get your documents in the faster you will be notified of a place. Remember: the early bird always gets the worm.

Note: PIL is not applicable outside of academia.</blockquote>

Do you mean PIL as an LLM or that particular branch of law? Are other LLMs more valuable? I think for what I want to do an LLM in PIL is the best path (if I am to do an LLM, otherwise I'd stay in Canada and get a JD).
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Brainy Smu...
Q:Do you mean PIL as an LLM or that particular branch of law?
A: concentration (or branch of law).
Q:Are other LLMs more valuable?
A:Yes, tax law.

Are your plans are to be employed by an IGO/NGO? Unfortunately, it will not happen. All you will get out of this one year venture, sadly, will be a seasonal internship at a nearby international tribunal, which does not contribute to real-time experience.

Seriously, research every angle of this programme. If you are only utilising this programme to escape from your home country (Canada) for a year. Do not waste your money/time.
Q:Do you mean PIL as an LLM or that particular branch of law?
A: concentration (or branch of law).
Q:Are other LLMs more valuable?
A:Yes, tax law.

Are your plans are to be employed by an IGO/NGO? Unfortunately, it will not happen. All you will get out of this one year venture, sadly, will be a seasonal internship at a nearby international tribunal, which does not contribute to real-time experience.

Seriously, research every angle of this programme. If you are only utilising this programme to escape from your home country (Canada) for a year. Do not waste your money/time.
quote
What I hope to gain out of this programme is knowledge about humanitarian and international law. I want to use it to fulfill the United Nation's requirement for an "advanced degree" (which they consider a Masters or above). I am hoping to get a job in one of the two UN job networks: the legal field or the political, peace, and security field. I was thinking this would allow me to shed two years of schooling, travel, and have the ability to gain experience in the International Court of Justice or the International Criminal Court.

Would this not be possible? I don't see why not.
What I hope to gain out of this programme is knowledge about humanitarian and international law. I want to use it to fulfill the United Nation's requirement for an "advanced degree" (which they consider a Masters or above). I am hoping to get a job in one of the two UN job networks: the legal field or the political, peace, and security field. I was thinking this would allow me to shed two years of schooling, travel, and have the ability to gain experience in the International Court of Justice or the International Criminal Court.

Would this not be possible? I don't see why not.
quote
nsmesiai
It is as possible as with any other LLM, and stating that PIL limits your options only into academia is extremely misleading and somewhat obscure. Furthermore, implying that a LLM from a certain are (in this case tax law) leads almost automatically into better working opportunities is simply not true. This is not the case with any specialization/LLM degree.

What matters is your work experience, recommendations, interest in the area you are applying for and extracurricular activities. It is possible to gain strengths in those areas no matter what's the degree. Always approach all statements critically and remember that "golden nuggets" to happiness/success do not exist. Competition is high, but studying PIL in a highly regarded institution is certainly not a bad move.
It is as possible as with any other LLM, and stating that PIL limits your options only into academia is extremely misleading and somewhat obscure. Furthermore, implying that a LLM from a certain are (in this case tax law) leads almost automatically into better working opportunities is simply not true. This is not the case with any specialization/LLM degree.

What matters is your work experience, recommendations, interest in the area you are applying for and extracurricular activities. It is possible to gain strengths in those areas no matter what's the degree. Always approach all statements critically and remember that "golden nuggets" to happiness/success do not exist. Competition is high, but studying PIL in a highly regarded institution is certainly not a bad move.
quote
Brainy Smu...
It is as possible as with any other LLM, and stating that PIL limits your options only into academia is extremely misleading and somewhat obscure. Furthermore, implying that a LLM from a certain are (in this case tax law) leads almost automatically into better working opportunities is simply not true. This is not the case with any specialization/LLM degree.

What matters is your work experience, recommendations, interest in the area you are applying for and extracurricular activities. It is possible to gain strengths in those areas no matter what's the degree. Always approach all statements critically and remember that "golden nuggets" to happiness/success do not exist. Competition is high, but studying PIL in a highly regarded institution is certainly not a bad move.


Not a bad move?

What is a single person gaining by taking a course in international law?

I am here to advise and not to mislead. Wasting money/time is the only conceivable matter that comes out of the venture. I intend to get our Canadian patron to seriously reconsider. To another person reading my reply just to bring an unambiguous response without reason, proves my reasons for assisting. The decision falls back on our Canadian patron. I digress.
<blockquote>It is as possible as with any other LLM, and stating that PIL limits your options only into academia is extremely misleading and somewhat obscure. Furthermore, implying that a LLM from a certain are (in this case tax law) leads almost automatically into better working opportunities is simply not true. This is not the case with any specialization/LLM degree.

What matters is your work experience, recommendations, interest in the area you are applying for and extracurricular activities. It is possible to gain strengths in those areas no matter what's the degree. Always approach all statements critically and remember that "golden nuggets" to happiness/success do not exist. Competition is high, but studying PIL in a highly regarded institution is certainly not a bad move. </blockquote>

Not a bad move?

What is a single person gaining by taking a course in international law?

I am here to advise and not to mislead. Wasting money/time is the only conceivable matter that comes out of the venture. I intend to get our Canadian patron to seriously reconsider. To another person reading my reply just to bring an unambiguous response without reason, proves my reasons for assisting. The decision falls back on our Canadian patron. I digress.
quote
Brainy Smu...
What I hope to gain out of this programme is knowledge about humanitarian and international law. I want to use it to fulfill the United Nation's requirement for an "advanced degree" (which they consider a Masters or above). I am hoping to get a job in one of the two UN job networks: the legal field or the political, peace, and security field. I was thinking this would allow me to shed two years of schooling, travel, and have the ability to gain experience in the International Court of Justice or the International Criminal Court.

Would this not be possible? I don't see why not.



I completely understand your reasons for endeavouring.

Nobody here will lead you astray.

Leiden is a well regarded university in the discipline of PIL.

Sadly, many before you applied and did not end up where they imagined.

I would suggest searching for a graduate programme in economics. Because, unfortunately, pursuing a LLM in PIL will not suffice. Have you ever wondered what happened to LLM-Guide posters who sought for the same programme? Majority of them end up wasting a year/two in PIL with nothing to show besides an advance degree lacking employment prospects. Look at the market for PIL. PIL can easily being mastered by buying the books and reading them yourself. Henceforth my reason for stating "PIL does not apply outside academia".

Flipping the coin. You will learn a lot from Leiden's PIL programme. If you do apply, I would highly recommend getting all of your documents in ASAP! Moreover, reserve an accommodation ASAP!

Kind regards.
<blockquote>What I hope to gain out of this programme is knowledge about humanitarian and international law. I want to use it to fulfill the United Nation's requirement for an "advanced degree" (which they consider a Masters or above). I am hoping to get a job in one of the two UN job networks: the legal field or the political, peace, and security field. I was thinking this would allow me to shed two years of schooling, travel, and have the ability to gain experience in the International Court of Justice or the International Criminal Court.

Would this not be possible? I don't see why not. </blockquote>


I completely understand your reasons for endeavouring.

Nobody here will lead you astray.

Leiden is a well regarded university in the discipline of PIL.

Sadly, many before you applied and did not end up where they imagined.

I would suggest searching for a graduate programme in economics. Because, unfortunately, pursuing a LLM in PIL will not suffice. Have you ever wondered what happened to LLM-Guide posters who sought for the same programme? Majority of them end up wasting a year/two in PIL with nothing to show besides an advance degree lacking employment prospects. Look at the market for PIL. PIL can easily being mastered by buying the books and reading them yourself. Henceforth my reason for stating "PIL does not apply outside academia".

Flipping the coin. You will learn a lot from Leiden's PIL programme. If you do apply, I would highly recommend getting all of your documents in ASAP! Moreover, reserve an accommodation ASAP!

Kind regards.
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Not arguing, I'm just trying to make sense of this so I can make the right decision. How would an economics degree be any different than a PIL degree, especially when international law is what I plan to work with? I can absolutely read books to develop a better understanding for PIL, but that won't show on paper. I could easily say the same for economics.

The UN's website shows profiles of UN workers and the education they received. There are several individuals that possess PIL LLMs or something similar to that. Maybe I will need a PhD or more work experience following a PIL LLM, but I do not see how it will not benefit me and be acceptable as the advanced degree the UN requires.
Not arguing, I'm just trying to make sense of this so I can make the right decision. How would an economics degree be any different than a PIL degree, especially when international law is what I plan to work with? I can absolutely read books to develop a better understanding for PIL, but that won't show on paper. I could easily say the same for economics.

The UN's website shows profiles of UN workers and the education they received. There are several individuals that possess PIL LLMs or something similar to that. Maybe I will need a PhD or more work experience following a PIL LLM, but I do not see how it will not benefit me and be acceptable as the advanced degree the UN requires.
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A few of the people I know who have done this masters have ended up working as diplomats and in international NGOs. However, all say there were long periods where they were unemployed and receiving numerous rejections. The LLM isn't a golden ticket to your ideal position, a lot of additional grafting is required, and with that comes a level of instability and uncertainty which is just not feasible for most people. There are jobs out there for those who come out top in the LLM and who have the dedication and the means to do (numerous!) unpaid internships. That said, unless your name is Good Will Hunting, you won't get a foot in the door of the UN by sitting at home and reading PIL books with no university accredited degree to show for it!

The majority of others I know who did this LLM and who were not so dedicated ended up in commercial law firms. Jobs are not as abundant in this field as in Tax/Economics - but value wise, an LLM in Tax is going to do you no good if your passion is for PIL.

Be realistic, work hard and research those who have been successful in getting to the position you would like to be in the future. Best of luck with your decision :)
A few of the people I know who have done this masters have ended up working as diplomats and in international NGOs. However, all say there were long periods where they were unemployed and receiving numerous rejections. The LLM isn't a golden ticket to your ideal position, a lot of additional grafting is required, and with that comes a level of instability and uncertainty which is just not feasible for most people. There are jobs out there for those who come out top in the LLM and who have the dedication and the means to do (numerous!) unpaid internships. That said, unless your name is Good Will Hunting, you won't get a foot in the door of the UN by sitting at home and reading PIL books with no university accredited degree to show for it!

The majority of others I know who did this LLM and who were not so dedicated ended up in commercial law firms. Jobs are not as abundant in this field as in Tax/Economics - but value wise, an LLM in Tax is going to do you no good if your passion is for PIL.

Be realistic, work hard and research those who have been successful in getting to the position you would like to be in the future. Best of luck with your decision :)
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hee-haw
I've just created this account to respond to the whole pessimism going around here.

Don't listen to nay-sayers. If PIL career is something that you feel strongly about - go for it, and Leiden PIL LLM is an excellent choice. If you're good and passionate about PIL, you'll be noticed, and you'll get there eventually. Yes, you may require a decent amount of luck (not if you're really good!), and a few months of unpaid internships, but it's certainly worth trying if an international career is what you're going for. I got a job at the International Criminal Court with my LLM, and there's no I would have gotten there hadn't I went for Leiden. A bunch of my class still work for various Hague tribunals and UN agencies.

And no, PIL LLM is not for academia only. A lot of international organizations will require an advanced law degree for you to be able to apply for jobs; see everything from the tribunals, ICC, to OHCHR, UNHCR, UN Secretariat, UN DPKO, and so on.

Having said that. I guess your undegrad is not in law (no LLB?). A three year JD studies would certainly trump one year LLM studies in value.
I've just created this account to respond to the whole pessimism going around here.

Don't listen to nay-sayers. If PIL career is something that you feel strongly about - go for it, and Leiden PIL LLM is an excellent choice. If you're good and passionate about PIL, you'll be noticed, and you'll get there eventually. Yes, you may require a decent amount of luck (not if you're really good!), and a few months of unpaid internships, but it's certainly worth trying if an international career is what you're going for. I got a job at the International Criminal Court with my LLM, and there's no I would have gotten there hadn't I went for Leiden. A bunch of my class still work for various Hague tribunals and UN agencies.

And no, PIL LLM is not for academia only. A lot of international organizations will require an advanced law degree for you to be able to apply for jobs; see everything from the tribunals, ICC, to OHCHR, UNHCR, UN Secretariat, UN DPKO, and so on.

Having said that. I guess your undegrad is not in law (no LLB?). A three year JD studies would certainly trump one year LLM studies in value.
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Thanks for sharing. No I do not have an LLB, in Canada you can obtain that (or a JD) after your undergrad. My undergrad is in political science. I am hoping to use my political science and PIL knowledge (if I get accepted in the future) to find an international legal job relevant to those two fields.
Thanks for sharing. No I do not have an LLB, in Canada you can obtain that (or a JD) after your undergrad. My undergrad is in political science. I am hoping to use my political science and PIL knowledge (if I get accepted in the future) to find an international legal job relevant to those two fields.
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hee-haw
I had a Canadian colleague with a BA in Political Science and an LLM. He did some interesting field jobs with international law, and later switched to academia. He teaches law now, which is a bit unusual for someone with no legal undergrad. But again, if you try hard, everything's possible. Just go for what you really feel like, that's your rule of thumb.
I had a Canadian colleague with a BA in Political Science and an LLM. He did some interesting field jobs with international law, and later switched to academia. He teaches law now, which is a bit unusual for someone with no legal undergrad. But again, if you try hard, everything's possible. Just go for what you really feel like, that's your rule of thumb.
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Hey! I have an LLB from a canadian uni as well and I have an LLM in Transational Commercial Law in Berlin. I passed both the Quebec and Ontario Bar. If u want to work for the ICC or the ICJ the masters in human rights law or public international law or any masters is amazint since they want a masters degree! Good luck and pursue ur dreams:)
Hey! I have an LLB from a canadian uni as well and I have an LLM in Transational Commercial Law in Berlin. I passed both the Quebec and Ontario Bar. If u want to work for the ICC or the ICJ the masters in human rights law or public international law or any masters is amazint since they want a masters degree! Good luck and pursue ur dreams:)
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