Choosing a college at Cambridge


dolharz
Hello,

I'm in the middle of applying for an LLM at Cam. I would like to ask for a tip on choosing the "right" college. My wishes and personal traits are as follows:

1. Close to the Law faculty.
2. "Mature" or "Postgraduate".
3. Able to provide a residence, since I wouldn't like to seek an appartment in October.
4. International.
5. "Boring". I'm not a wild party animal and generally prefer calm environment.

Any advice or comment will be very helpful!

Yours, Ziga, Slovenia
Hello,

I'm in the middle of applying for an LLM at Cam. I would like to ask for a tip on choosing the "right" college. My wishes and personal traits are as follows:

1. Close to the Law faculty.
2. "Mature" or "Postgraduate".
3. Able to provide a residence, since I wouldn't like to seek an appartment in October.
4. International.
5. "Boring". I'm not a wild party animal and generally prefer calm environment.

Any advice or comment will be very helpful!

Yours, Ziga, Slovenia
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Dutchman
A small guide:
www.llm-guide.com/board/92941
However, none of your criteria (except for 3 and maybe 4) applied to my selection :P.
If you are serious about that, then you'll definitely get your first choice college, as this only leaves the real s*** colleges like Hughes Hall, etc. However, you'll probably also have a very boring year and not learn anything about what Cambridge really is all about.
A small guide:
www.llm-guide.com/board/92941
However, none of your criteria (except for 3 and maybe 4) applied to my selection :P.
If you are serious about that, then you'll definitely get your first choice college, as this only leaves the real s*** colleges like Hughes Hall, etc. However, you'll probably also have a very boring year and not learn anything about what Cambridge really is all about.
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Claire Hall, Darwin, Wolfson
Darwin is the closest 3(5 min walk)
Wolfson (10 min walk) is the most international and with the best on site (!) accommodation
Claire Hall is the most boring but all three are pretty studious.
Darwin/Claire has the best location for the city centre but not as good for accommodation, most is not on-site
Claire Hall, Darwin, Wolfson
Darwin is the closest 3(5 min walk)
Wolfson (10 min walk) is the most international and with the best on site (!) accommodation
Claire Hall is the most boring but all three are pretty studious.
Darwin/Claire has the best location for the city centre but not as good for accommodation, most is not on-site
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Claire Hall is the "old" one out of the three but Wolfson has been coming through the ranks very strongly, but be aware - very large Asian contingent compared to other colleges. That's why it has been very good academically at postgrad level - Asians work hard. It also caters for more "grown" up entertainment - tango classes, aerobics, stand-up comedy, jazz nights, quizz nights. Other colleges tend to go with more "go to the pub and disco all night entertainment"
Claire Hall is the "old" one out of the three but Wolfson has been coming through the ranks very strongly, but be aware - very large Asian contingent compared to other colleges. That's why it has been very good academically at postgrad level - Asians work hard. It also caters for more "grown" up entertainment - tango classes, aerobics, stand-up comedy, jazz nights, quizz nights. Other colleges tend to go with more "go to the pub and disco all night entertainment"
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Dutchman
Selwyn is the closest college to the Law Faculty Building, but it's not grad/mature-only. I sometimes go to their hall for lunch, it's one of the younger colleges, but with pretty awesome buildings nonetheless. However, please be aware that the distance of your college really is not a big deal (except for Churchill and St Edmunds maybe), since Cambridge, or at least the "academic part of it", is VERY small.
Again, my advice would be: Reconsider your preferences. Go for a traditional college, as it is there that you will get the classic Cambridge experience (don't give Trinity, St Johns or Kings as a first choice, though, as they usually take few or no LLMers).

PS: Several LLMers who (involuntarily) ended up at Grad/Mature Colleges told me they were rather jealous of me having got into one of the older ones. So obviously, they are not perfectly content with their College, which might prove a point here.
Selwyn is the closest college to the Law Faculty Building, but it's not grad/mature-only. I sometimes go to their hall for lunch, it's one of the younger colleges, but with pretty awesome buildings nonetheless. However, please be aware that the distance of your college really is not a big deal (except for Churchill and St Edmunds maybe), since Cambridge, or at least the "academic part of it", is VERY small.
Again, my advice would be: Reconsider your preferences. Go for a traditional college, as it is there that you will get the classic Cambridge experience (don't give Trinity, St Johns or Kings as a first choice, though, as they usually take few or no LLMers).

PS: Several LLMers who (involuntarily) ended up at Grad/Mature Colleges told me they were rather jealous of me having got into one of the older ones. So obviously, they are not perfectly content with their College, which might prove a point here.
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This is not quite right, Dutchman
Distance does matter when you have your classes, your seminars, your college admin things and your accommodation in 4 different corners of the city. Cambridge is not that small. Say, if you have to travel to London for interviews/internship on a regular basis (as I had to) Wolfson is not ideal for the railway station. It is on the opposite side of the town - can take up to 15 min by taxi to get there, costs at least GBP 6. No busses go that way so you are looking for at least GBP 12 round trip. If you are in Emanuel or Downing you can walk to the station easily. Also these two colleges are close to the bus station area near the Green so as to the swimming pool (if you like swimming).
Also places like Darwin, Wolfson and anything the other side of St Catherines are quite far away from the supermarket which is on the market square. This means that you are really stuck with college food or take-away pizza if you did not have the time to buy your groceries. This was a huge inconvenience at Wolfson as the journey to the grocery store entailed at least a 45 min walking trip (20 minutes each way). At the same time Wolfson and Darwin do not have tourists and becase they are further down more people tend to stay in the college in the evenings, providing for more and better activities within the college a better community, less money needed to be spent on social aspects and better social life in general
This is not quite right, Dutchman
Distance does matter when you have your classes, your seminars, your college admin things and your accommodation in 4 different corners of the city. Cambridge is not that small. Say, if you have to travel to London for interviews/internship on a regular basis (as I had to) Wolfson is not ideal for the railway station. It is on the opposite side of the town - can take up to 15 min by taxi to get there, costs at least GBP 6. No busses go that way so you are looking for at least GBP 12 round trip. If you are in Emanuel or Downing you can walk to the station easily. Also these two colleges are close to the bus station area near the Green so as to the swimming pool (if you like swimming).
Also places like Darwin, Wolfson and anything the other side of St Catherines are quite far away from the supermarket which is on the market square. This means that you are really stuck with college food or take-away pizza if you did not have the time to buy your groceries. This was a huge inconvenience at Wolfson as the journey to the grocery store entailed at least a 45 min walking trip (20 minutes each way). At the same time Wolfson and Darwin do not have tourists and becase they are further down more people tend to stay in the college in the evenings, providing for more and better activities within the college a better community, less money needed to be spent on social aspects and better social life in general
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You are right - if you can get into the grander colleges, do it - they do have better "outside" reputation and I am envious for that reason. However, the smaller older colleges are overun with people under 20 years old and can feel a bit as a kindergarden for an older person. They are just at a different stage of their lives....Not a problem in a larger older colleges as postgrads do make a sizeable percentage in terms of absolute numbers.
However, if postgrad college is for you and you do not want a single sex one, Wolfson is definitely more on the up compared to Darwin and Claire, mainly because they get funding from one of the top businessman in Singapore. It should continue to do really well in the coming 5 years, partly because the current vice-chancellor (the chancellor is Prince Phillip, I believe) was a fellow at Wolfson for many years...Darwin kind of dissapeared somewhere, despite the fact that it is the only postgrad college with a river frontage :-)
For those reading: I would personally disregard Huges and Homerton as colleges noone wants to get into full stop. St Edmunds as well unless you are into boat racing, they seem to produce the largest number of people in the boat racing team. Wolfson is a good one if you like an American-style campus environment, it will remind you of a minuature version, Darwin is a good one if you like to be next to the river in "haunted house" look-alike grey building. Claire if you like you country-house style properties
You are right - if you can get into the grander colleges, do it - they do have better "outside" reputation and I am envious for that reason. However, the smaller older colleges are overun with people under 20 years old and can feel a bit as a kindergarden for an older person. They are just at a different stage of their lives....Not a problem in a larger older colleges as postgrads do make a sizeable percentage in terms of absolute numbers.
However, if postgrad college is for you and you do not want a single sex one, Wolfson is definitely more on the up compared to Darwin and Claire, mainly because they get funding from one of the top businessman in Singapore. It should continue to do really well in the coming 5 years, partly because the current vice-chancellor (the chancellor is Prince Phillip, I believe) was a fellow at Wolfson for many years...Darwin kind of dissapeared somewhere, despite the fact that it is the only postgrad college with a river frontage :-)
For those reading: I would personally disregard Huges and Homerton as colleges noone wants to get into full stop. St Edmunds as well unless you are into boat racing, they seem to produce the largest number of people in the boat racing team. Wolfson is a good one if you like an American-style campus environment, it will remind you of a minuature version, Darwin is a good one if you like to be next to the river in "haunted house" look-alike grey building. Claire if you like you country-house style properties
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Was thinking about this overnight....On the balance of probabilities I would recommend you to put Darwin as your first choice (thought went to Wolfson myself). Reasons:
1. The closest mixed sex to thr law facility and all of the libraries
2. Postgraduate
3. Old style buildings
4. River frontage similar to much older colleges
5. To outsiders not immeidately recognised as a new college = most people think that it is an old station
6. 5 min to the city centre and supermarkets
7. Possible to walk to the train station (mind you still 25 -30 min walk, but possible)
8, 15 min walk to the bus station and swimming pool
9. Still slightly away from the crazy tourists
10. Close to Wolfson where the best social activities among Cambridge colleges take place, often Darwin people can attend them for free due to close relationship between these 2 colleges
11. More balanced interms nationalities and genders
Was thinking about this overnight....On the balance of probabilities I would recommend you to put Darwin as your first choice (thought went to Wolfson myself). Reasons:
1. The closest mixed sex to thr law facility and all of the libraries
2. Postgraduate
3. Old style buildings
4. River frontage similar to much older colleges
5. To outsiders not immeidately recognised as a new college = most people think that it is an old station
6. 5 min to the city centre and supermarkets
7. Possible to walk to the train station (mind you still 25 -30 min walk, but possible)
8, 15 min walk to the bus station and swimming pool
9. Still slightly away from the crazy tourists
10. Close to Wolfson where the best social activities among Cambridge colleges take place, often Darwin people can attend them for free due to close relationship between these 2 colleges
11. More balanced interms nationalities and genders
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Dutchman
Yeah, if you really want to stick to your preferences (I won't repeat my advice), then PE's recommendation is a really good one. Darwin and Wolfson are certainly among the "lesser evils" of grad/mature Colleges :-).

Just another word on distances: I live in the northern part of the city centre (the Faculty is not in Central Cambridge!), which is rather far away (in Cambridge terms...) from the Faculty on the Sidgwick sitse. Still, it's only a 10-15 minutes (beautiful!) walk, and I really prefer that central accomodation to living on the backs and closer to the institutes. You won't have too many lectures anyway (4/week to be precise) and nearly everyone here has a bike, so I definitely hold my opinion that distances are usually NOT a problem here.
Yeah, if you really want to stick to your preferences (I won't repeat my advice), then PE's recommendation is a really good one. Darwin and Wolfson are certainly among the "lesser evils" of grad/mature Colleges :-).

Just another word on distances: I live in the northern part of the city centre (the Faculty is not in Central Cambridge!), which is rather far away (in Cambridge terms...) from the Faculty on the Sidgwick sitse. Still, it's only a 10-15 minutes (beautiful!) walk, and I really prefer that central accomodation to living on the backs and closer to the institutes. You won't have too many lectures anyway (4/week to be precise) and nearly everyone here has a bike, so I definitely hold my opinion that distances are usually NOT a problem here.
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dolharz
Apparently, it was a wise idea to stay away from this topic and allow you two to talk it through :-).

You both put forward valid questions (and doubts about my preferences). While Dutchman at times challenged my expectations, it seems that I have - at least in my current expectations - more in common with PE :). I also read the other topic you linked.

As regards the proximity to the faculty, I agree that up to 30 minutes by foot is "close enough" for me, especially if that also means that accommodations are at the same place. (Beforehand, I thought that all "colleges" were in fact "dormitories" - big old Victoriesque houses with beds. Apparently, I read too much Harry Potter!). Although proximity to railway and bus stations is a plus, I (yet) do not believe I'll be travelling that much.

From what I've read both in this topic, wikipedia and colleges' websites, It seems I'll choose Wolfson and Darwin. (Still, I have to be admitted to the faculty in the first place. Congratulations to both of you!)
Apparently, it was a wise idea to stay away from this topic and allow you two to talk it through :-).

You both put forward valid questions (and doubts about my preferences). While Dutchman at times challenged my expectations, it seems that I have - at least in my current expectations - more in common with PE :). I also read the other topic you linked.

As regards the proximity to the faculty, I agree that up to 30 minutes by foot is "close enough" for me, especially if that also means that accommodations are at the same place. (Beforehand, I thought that all "colleges" were in fact "dormitories" - big old Victoriesque houses with beds. Apparently, I read too much Harry Potter!). Although proximity to railway and bus stations is a plus, I (yet) do not believe I'll be travelling that much.

From what I've read both in this topic, wikipedia and colleges' websites, It seems I'll choose Wolfson and Darwin. (Still, I have to be admitted to the faculty in the first place. Congratulations to both of you!)
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JsDupont
Too bad I just discovered this board now that I've sent my application to Cambridge... I spent hours choosing my 2 colleges and according to you are saying, I think I made 2 bad choices: Trinity and Hughes Hall :/
Too bad I just discovered this board now that I've sent my application to Cambridge... I spent hours choosing my 2 colleges and according to you are saying, I think I made 2 bad choices: Trinity and Hughes Hall :/

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Yes, unfortunately I have to say so JsDupont. Unless you have something special, you are unlikely to get into Trinity and noone who asked was never turned away by Hughes Hall..obvious reasons...I suggest the following, wait till you get accepted by the faculty and rejected by Trinity. Then you can try to contact the Board of Graduate Studies with a credible reason as to why Hughes Hall is not the one for you. Then the computer will generate the next best choice. Unless you are a girl you cannot do worse than Hughes Hall, so things will be looking much brighter...If you are a girl this might be a risky move as you are likely to get a single sex one...That's how I got Wolfson...I selected Trinity and Emanuel, got rejected, then got allocated into a single sex college, gave a reasoning as to why I do not want to go there and got Wolfson.
Actually I am glad I did - in terms of organisation, this college is superb, everything runs like clock-work (must be a Singaporean Influence). Nothing ever gets lost, over-paid amounts are promptly refunded, broken things fixed. Most students (previously all students) but the college is becoming quite popular - get a room on site, and most rooms are ensuite. The college management was also very kind to allow my parents visitng me to stay in a professor's room (who was abroad) and they only charged about GBP 20 per night. The quality of the room was not dissimilar to a 3* hotel, they even provided smart toiletries!
You would not believe but some Trinity people have to go to the bathroom and to take a shower to the other side of the buidlng, sometimes to another building!
If you are looking for convenience and good estate management, this is the right college. But it does not have the glamour of the old colleges, Saying that my friend was at Emanuel and the college porter lost his keys and then was out. So the guy had to stay in his friend's room for 2 nights...
Yes, unfortunately I have to say so JsDupont. Unless you have something special, you are unlikely to get into Trinity and noone who asked was never turned away by Hughes Hall..obvious reasons...I suggest the following, wait till you get accepted by the faculty and rejected by Trinity. Then you can try to contact the Board of Graduate Studies with a credible reason as to why Hughes Hall is not the one for you. Then the computer will generate the next best choice. Unless you are a girl you cannot do worse than Hughes Hall, so things will be looking much brighter...If you are a girl this might be a risky move as you are likely to get a single sex one...That's how I got Wolfson...I selected Trinity and Emanuel, got rejected, then got allocated into a single sex college, gave a reasoning as to why I do not want to go there and got Wolfson.
Actually I am glad I did - in terms of organisation, this college is superb, everything runs like clock-work (must be a Singaporean Influence). Nothing ever gets lost, over-paid amounts are promptly refunded, broken things fixed. Most students (previously all students) but the college is becoming quite popular - get a room on site, and most rooms are ensuite. The college management was also very kind to allow my parents visitng me to stay in a professor's room (who was abroad) and they only charged about GBP 20 per night. The quality of the room was not dissimilar to a 3* hotel, they even provided smart toiletries!
You would not believe but some Trinity people have to go to the bathroom and to take a shower to the other side of the buidlng, sometimes to another building!
If you are looking for convenience and good estate management, this is the right college. But it does not have the glamour of the old colleges, Saying that my friend was at Emanuel and the college porter lost his keys and then was out. So the guy had to stay in his friend's room for 2 nights...
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JsDupont
What's so bad about Hughes? :S
What's so bad about Hughes? :S
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Quite far to the facility, limited facilities and entertainment ability in the college, poor reputation as college for rejects, and, apparently, looks like a housing estate (though I did not go there so cannot tell for sure and it does look nice in this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFdMppBtUVI&feature=fvsr). However, of all 2010 LLMs living there not a single one was over the moon, but might be personal...Maybe it is just a bit more popular with MBAs, which is not a bad thing...You know what, maybe it is not the college but the professors...self fulfilling profecy. Some of the professors are unbelievably elitist, so when you mention Hughes Hall you can just here "oh, well, how can I help you"? When you say Trinity, St John etc they cannot help but think "a bright lad/girl". They do not say it but you can spot non-verbal communication
Quite far to the facility, limited facilities and entertainment ability in the college, poor reputation as college for rejects, and, apparently, looks like a housing estate (though I did not go there so cannot tell for sure and it does look nice in this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFdMppBtUVI&feature=fvsr). However, of all 2010 LLMs living there not a single one was over the moon, but might be personal...Maybe it is just a bit more popular with MBAs, which is not a bad thing...You know what, maybe it is not the college but the professors...self fulfilling profecy. Some of the professors are unbelievably elitist, so when you mention Hughes Hall you can just here "oh, well, how can I help you"? When you say Trinity, St John etc they cannot help but think "a bright lad/girl". They do not say it but you can spot non-verbal communication
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JsDupont
Ok... I'll to be made an offer and may try to follow your suggestion! Thank you for the advice

The worst is that I almost chose Wolfson :/
Ok... I'll to be made an offer and may try to follow your suggestion! Thank you for the advice

The worst is that I almost chose Wolfson :/
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Dutchman
Dupont, a piece of advice:
Change College preferences! I know the homepage says you can't, but this is not quite correct, you can. I did it myself.
Wait till you get the informal offer email from Mrs Wade, then send her a friendly email asking whether it might still be possible to change the preferences and indicate your first and second choice. This apparently worked for several LLMers last year as it did for me. Best of luck,
Dutchman
Dupont, a piece of advice:
Change College preferences! I know the homepage says you can't, but this is not quite correct, you can. I did it myself.
Wait till you get the informal offer email from Mrs Wade, then send her a friendly email asking whether it might still be possible to change the preferences and indicate your first and second choice. This apparently worked for several LLMers last year as it did for me. Best of luck,
Dutchman
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JsDupont
Dutchman: thank you for the advice! I'll definitely do that. I just hope I get this e-mail from Mrs. Wade ;)
Dutchman: thank you for the advice! I'll definitely do that. I just hope I get this e-mail from Mrs. Wade ;)
quote
Excellent series of posts. Any strategic advice for Law PhD applicants in choosing colleges? I'd prefer an older college and a central location. Any idea about where most PhD students dwell?
Excellent series of posts. Any strategic advice for Law PhD applicants in choosing colleges? I'd prefer an older college and a central location. Any idea about where most PhD students dwell?
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Excellent series of posts. Any strategic advice for Law PhD applicants in choosing colleges? I'd prefer an older college and a central location. Any idea about where most PhD students dwell?


I'm an LLM student at Magdalene, and it might be worth your while to consider for a few reasons:

- It's an old, central river college with few tourists
- About a fifteen minute walk to the Law Faculty
- Longest river frontage of any college - every day, I get to walk home through the college along the Cam
- Ten minutes walk to Sainsbury's (the central grocery store); pretty much close to everything else in the center of town (2-15 minutes from lots of good restaurants and shops, depending on where you're trying to go)
- Good group of law students - this year we have five LLMs and one PhD - all lots of fun and very friendly. I don't really have insight into whether there are colleges where you'd have a much larger group of law PhD students, if that's something that's important to you, though. However, Magdalene welcomes law students - in fact, our current Dean (Roger O'Keefe) is a law prof. This isn't true of all of the central, old river colleges - I know Trinity and King's only take one LLM student each year, though I'm not sure how many law PhD students they take if any. I listed Magdalene as my second choice, and they took me.
- Magd is a very traditional college, good for someone who wants "the Cambridge experience." We have a (very affordable) Formal Hall option every night - three-course dinner by candlelight, and Cambridge's only white-tie May Ball.
- Very friendly group of students, staff, porters, etc

Potential issues with Magd:
- It's not a rich college. If you need significant funding from your college, you're not likely to get it here as a law student. If you need small sums, they might be able to help (e.g., they're subsidizing an extracurricular foreign language course I'm taking next term).
- Old college + poor college = not five-star accommodation. For instance, there are very few en-suites - and even if you get one, they're really like water closets, emphasis on the closet. Still, friends at John's and Trinity tell me their accommodation is worse, so this might be an occupational hazard of choosing an old central college. The newer colleges have, obviously, newer accommodation - though some of their students complain that it looks too new and not pretty/old/traditional Cambridge.
- As a jeans and t-shirts person myself, Magd strikes me as being very fashionable at times. There are plenty of black-tie dinners/formal halls/parties which aren't exactly what I was looking for, though I suck it up, dress formally, and go every so often. But this might be exactly what you're looking for - it can be quite the classy college.
- The food is neither the best nor worst in Cambridge. I don't really have any major complaints about it, and I eat at the cafeteria regularly. But when I want a really tasty meal, I bite the bullet and go to a restaurant.
<blockquote>Excellent series of posts. Any strategic advice for Law PhD applicants in choosing colleges? I'd prefer an older college and a central location. Any idea about where most PhD students dwell?</blockquote>

I'm an LLM student at Magdalene, and it might be worth your while to consider for a few reasons:

- It's an old, central river college with few tourists
- About a fifteen minute walk to the Law Faculty
- Longest river frontage of any college - every day, I get to walk home through the college along the Cam
- Ten minutes walk to Sainsbury's (the central grocery store); pretty much close to everything else in the center of town (2-15 minutes from lots of good restaurants and shops, depending on where you're trying to go)
- Good group of law students - this year we have five LLMs and one PhD - all lots of fun and very friendly. I don't really have insight into whether there are colleges where you'd have a much larger group of law PhD students, if that's something that's important to you, though. However, Magdalene welcomes law students - in fact, our current Dean (Roger O'Keefe) is a law prof. This isn't true of all of the central, old river colleges - I know Trinity and King's only take one LLM student each year, though I'm not sure how many law PhD students they take if any. I listed Magdalene as my second choice, and they took me.
- Magd is a very traditional college, good for someone who wants "the Cambridge experience." We have a (very affordable) Formal Hall option every night - three-course dinner by candlelight, and Cambridge's only white-tie May Ball.
- Very friendly group of students, staff, porters, etc

Potential issues with Magd:
- It's not a rich college. If you need significant funding from your college, you're not likely to get it here as a law student. If you need small sums, they might be able to help (e.g., they're subsidizing an extracurricular foreign language course I'm taking next term).
- Old college + poor college = not five-star accommodation. For instance, there are very few en-suites - and even if you get one, they're really like water closets, emphasis on the closet. Still, friends at John's and Trinity tell me their accommodation is worse, so this might be an occupational hazard of choosing an old central college. The newer colleges have, obviously, newer accommodation - though some of their students complain that it looks too new and not pretty/old/traditional Cambridge.
- As a jeans and t-shirts person myself, Magd strikes me as being very fashionable at times. There are plenty of black-tie dinners/formal halls/parties which aren't exactly what I was looking for, though I suck it up, dress formally, and go every so often. But this might be exactly what you're looking for - it can be quite the classy college.
- The food is neither the best nor worst in Cambridge. I don't really have any major complaints about it, and I eat at the cafeteria regularly. But when I want a really tasty meal, I bite the bullet and go to a restaurant.
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smallflowe
Hello, I'm applying to Cambridge LLM 2016 and I really am torn about college preference... So far I have narrowed down my preference to Downing, Pembroke, Jesus, and Wolfson. Can any of you kindly give me an advice on which college is the best for LLM student among those four colleges and why? Thank you in advance!
Hello, I'm applying to Cambridge LLM 2016 and I really am torn about college preference... So far I have narrowed down my preference to Downing, Pembroke, Jesus, and Wolfson. Can any of you kindly give me an advice on which college is the best for LLM student among those four colleges and why? Thank you in advance!
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