LLM Law & Tech: Leiden or Tilburg


moraest
Hello there!
I've been on a struggle on deciding between doing a LLM on Law & Technology at Leiden or Tilburg.
As far as I've researched, Leiden is better recognized for law in general (internationally speaking), but in this particular LLM, Tilburg has more researches (maybe because the course is older there).
The thing is: my budget is tight and the scholarship that was offered me in Tilburg is quite better. But I am really unsure if it has an international recognition good enough in this LLM regarding job opportunities and academic development (i.e. doing a PhD in a top-level university after Tilburg).
Any help is welcome!
Hello there!
I've been on a struggle on deciding between doing a LLM on Law & Technology at Leiden or Tilburg.
As far as I've researched, Leiden is better recognized for law in general (internationally speaking), but in this particular LLM, Tilburg has more researches (maybe because the course is older there).
The thing is: my budget is tight and the scholarship that was offered me in Tilburg is quite better. But I am really unsure if it has an international recognition good enough in this LLM regarding job opportunities and academic development (i.e. doing a PhD in a top-level university after Tilburg).
Any help is welcome!
quote
Helinso
Hello all!

I’am in the same hesitation with moraest. Is there anyone to provide some information?

Thank you
Hello all!

I’am in the same hesitation with moraest. Is there anyone to provide some information?

Thank you
quote
Maybe I can give you the feedback myself. In the end I decided for Tilburg and I'm very happy with my decision. It's a good university and TiLT has a wide connection with the market, so very good for networking. The only thing that kinda sux is the city itself, but in the Netherlands everything is so close that it doesn't really matters.
Maybe I can give you the feedback myself. In the end I decided for Tilburg and I'm very happy with my decision. It's a good university and TiLT has a wide connection with the market, so very good for networking. The only thing that kinda sux is the city itself, but in the Netherlands everything is so close that it doesn't really matters.
quote
ZardLex
Hello all,
Little disclaimer here - I'm Leiden LDT alumni, can be little biased, but will try to give you an objective picture through my personal observations.
I just came back from "TILTing perspectives" conference in Tilburg that was quite nice and is regarded as one of the major events for academia in the field (law, regulation & technology) in Europe. I admire many prof. and researchers there and cannot really say that the quility of the research in Tilburg is any lower than in Leiden.
However, apart from that there is no comparison between the two. Not only Leiden is more recognized throughout the world, you feel the prestige as a student as well, as it is the oldest uni in the Netherlands and the whole city is built around it. The city is one of the most beautiful places (if not the most) in NL and student life is simply amazing. While amst and the Hague are very close many people (incl. me) would even want to leave Leid.
As I understood your main concern is continuing PhD in top-tier uni and if they will recognize your TILT degree. If you want to pursue doctoral degree in US than Leiden is def more recognized than Til. However, you should know that in Europe (including UK) TILT and eLaw are at the top of the research in this specific field. If there was ranking for technology law unis both would def make top 10 (maybe even top 5). So if you consider top-tier to be oxbridge or LSE, they do recognize Leiden and Tilburg degrees in this field.
In industry Leiden is more well-known.
I beleive both unis to be a good choice. It all depends on your dedication and performance. I hope my observations and opinions will help you guys.

[Edited by ZardLex on May 17, 2019]

Hello all,
Little disclaimer here - I'm Leiden LDT alumni, can be little biased, but will try to give you an objective picture through my personal observations.
I just came back from "TILTing perspectives" conference in Tilburg that was quite nice and is regarded as one of the major events for academia in the field (law, regulation & technology) in Europe. I admire many prof. and researchers there and cannot really say that the quility of the research in Tilburg is any lower than in Leiden.
However, apart from that there is no comparison between the two. Not only Leiden is more recognized throughout the world, you feel the prestige as a student as well, as it is the oldest uni in the Netherlands and the whole city is built around it. The city is one of the most beautiful places (if not the most) in NL and student life is simply amazing. While amst and the Hague are very close many people (incl. me) would even want to leave Leid.
As I understood your main concern is continuing PhD in top-tier uni and if they will recognize your TILT degree. If you want to pursue doctoral degree in US than Leiden is def more recognized than Til. However, you should know that in Europe (including UK) TILT and eLaw are at the top of the research in this specific field. If there was ranking for technology law unis both would def make top 10 (maybe even top 5). So if you consider top-tier to be oxbridge or LSE, they do recognize Leiden and Tilburg degrees in this field.
In industry Leiden is more well-known.
I beleive both unis to be a good choice. It all depends on your dedication and performance. I hope my observations and opinions will help you guys.



quote
guamelo45
I will try to analyze both institutes objectively. At the end of the day you have to take a decision, and there are many yardsticks to based your decision on, all of them lead to different results.

Content-based: Tilburg University Law and tech program content is better configurated from a "hard law" perspective. If you compare both programs, Leiden´s content is more abstract, ethical and societal focused. Leiden concentrates more on digital technologies, is more internet based. Tilburg is more privacy and IP focused, which on my perspective are the main two pillars of law and tech. I recently came from Internet Law Summer School at UNIGE, one of the best law and tech initiatives worldwide in this area, with the collaboration of Harvard, Renmin, ITS, ITU, and WIPO. You can see that for the market Cyber, Privacy and IP are the most attractive areas for law and tech, and where most of the money is being poured. In this regard, Tilburg offers more specialization courses on IP and Privacy. Tilburg has also another advantage, it was recently merged with Tilburg Law and Economics Center (TILEC), so it offers market-based approaches in its LL.M. I follow both institutions in the media, and TILT is by far organizing more events than eLaw and attracting more researchers for conferences and seminars as a consequence of their vast resources.

Research-based: Tilburg TILT is a more developed institute due to its long trajectory and resources. It was built 35 years ago and has over 70 researchers and professors. eLaw has a more reduced group varying from 10-20 people. Tilburg has several ERC and European research grants holders, and is leading law and tech research papers in Europe.

Prestige-based: we have to differentiate between overall prestige and sector-based prestige. This is something that from a societal perspective is diluted and naively regarded. Leiden University is with Sorbonne and KU Leuven the most overall prestige university in continental Europe. This prestige is poured to eLaw or any other department associated with Leiden Law School, this does not mean that eLaw has such international prestige as a law and tech research institution. Leiden university prestige comes mainly from EU and International Law. Of course, Tilburg does not have such status and is by far internationally worse regarded.

Economic-based: no comparison, TILT wins: 2000 Euros TILT and 17500 Euros Leiden for a similar education.

Environment-based: Tilburg city sucks. Leiden is a really nice city with a real university environment. Also, Leiden has more history than Tilburg. Classes in Leiden are reduced, circa 40 students, and TILT has around 120 students. There is by far a better environment in Leiden.

Takeaways: from a content-based, Tilburg LL.M offers better content and networking opportunities due to their master configuration and resources. From an academic perspective, if you want to pursue PhD. both institutions offer good solutions, although Leiden could be a better bridge option due to its more abstract content and overall prestige as a university.

It is difficult to decide, if the world was a smart-fair place, I would go for TILT, its added-value as a "program" is by far better than Leiden. However, branding is important in life and says a lot about people. You can unproblematically acquire qualitative knowledge by doing online courses or by educating yourself. You cannot say the same for prestige. We live in a world of appearance, and logos matter. If you have the money, I would go for Leiden. If not, you will also win because TILT offers a price-education relationship which gives so much added value to the student that you should consider it as a victory.
I will try to analyze both institutes objectively. At the end of the day you have to take a decision, and there are many yardsticks to based your decision on, all of them lead to different results.

Content-based: Tilburg University Law and tech program content is better configurated from a "hard law" perspective. If you compare both programs, Leiden´s content is more abstract, ethical and societal focused. Leiden concentrates more on digital technologies, is more internet based. Tilburg is more privacy and IP focused, which on my perspective are the main two pillars of law and tech. I recently came from Internet Law Summer School at UNIGE, one of the best law and tech initiatives worldwide in this area, with the collaboration of Harvard, Renmin, ITS, ITU, and WIPO. You can see that for the market Cyber, Privacy and IP are the most attractive areas for law and tech, and where most of the money is being poured. In this regard, Tilburg offers more specialization courses on IP and Privacy. Tilburg has also another advantage, it was recently merged with Tilburg Law and Economics Center (TILEC), so it offers market-based approaches in its LL.M. I follow both institutions in the media, and TILT is by far organizing more events than eLaw and attracting more researchers for conferences and seminars as a consequence of their vast resources.

Research-based: Tilburg TILT is a more developed institute due to its long trajectory and resources. It was built 35 years ago and has over 70 researchers and professors. eLaw has a more reduced group varying from 10-20 people. Tilburg has several ERC and European research grants holders, and is leading law and tech research papers in Europe.

Prestige-based: we have to differentiate between overall prestige and sector-based prestige. This is something that from a societal perspective is diluted and naively regarded. Leiden University is with Sorbonne and KU Leuven the most overall prestige university in continental Europe. This prestige is poured to eLaw or any other department associated with Leiden Law School, this does not mean that eLaw has such international prestige as a law and tech research institution. Leiden university prestige comes mainly from EU and International Law. Of course, Tilburg does not have such status and is by far internationally worse regarded.

Economic-based: no comparison, TILT wins: 2000 Euros TILT and 17500 Euros Leiden for a similar education.

Environment-based: Tilburg city sucks. Leiden is a really nice city with a real university environment. Also, Leiden has more history than Tilburg. Classes in Leiden are reduced, circa 40 students, and TILT has around 120 students. There is by far a better environment in Leiden.

Takeaways: from a content-based, Tilburg LL.M offers better content and networking opportunities due to their master configuration and resources. From an academic perspective, if you want to pursue PhD. both institutions offer good solutions, although Leiden could be a better bridge option due to its more abstract content and overall prestige as a university.

It is difficult to decide, if the world was a smart-fair place, I would go for TILT, its added-value as a "program" is by far better than Leiden. However, branding is important in life and says a lot about people. You can unproblematically acquire qualitative knowledge by doing online courses or by educating yourself. You cannot say the same for prestige. We live in a world of appearance, and logos matter. If you have the money, I would go for Leiden. If not, you will also win because TILT offers a price-education relationship which gives so much added value to the student that you should consider it as a victory.
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