Higher 2:2 Degree


Hi everyone,

This is my first post to the forum on a really important issue to me, so I hope you can give me some advice.

I am a graduate from the University of Toronto, with a 2.75cGPA. I am interested in LLM programs in Human Rights, in the UK, and I took my undergraduate degree in International Relations. I have excellent references and a note from my registrar documenting a series of personal events that interfered with my studies and grades.

I am interested in Warwick, Essex, Nottingham, possibly others... What are my chances? I am desperate to get into graduate school, and after taking some time from studies and reflecting, I know this is what I would like to pursue.

I would be willing to take a Masters in Politics, and then pursue law but I wonder if my grades will be sufficient to get into grad school at all in the UK. Also, according to Nottingham's website, a 2.5 GPA from U of T is a 2:2, while a 2.8 GPA is a 2:1 degree.

Thanks, and sorry for rambling, I hope you can help!
Hi everyone,

This is my first post to the forum on a really important issue to me, so I hope you can give me some advice.

I am a graduate from the University of Toronto, with a 2.75cGPA. I am interested in LLM programs in Human Rights, in the UK, and I took my undergraduate degree in International Relations. I have excellent references and a note from my registrar documenting a series of personal events that interfered with my studies and grades.

I am interested in Warwick, Essex, Nottingham, possibly others... What are my chances? I am desperate to get into graduate school, and after taking some time from studies and reflecting, I know this is what I would like to pursue.

I would be willing to take a Masters in Politics, and then pursue law but I wonder if my grades will be sufficient to get into grad school at all in the UK. Also, according to Nottingham's website, a 2.5 GPA from U of T is a 2:2, while a 2.8 GPA is a 2:1 degree.

Thanks, and sorry for rambling, I hope you can help!
quote
tnuchpiam
Judging from the experiences of the people I know who have applied to those universities, I feel that you have a good chance of being accepted by Warwick; perhaps an excellent chance of being offered a place at Essex; and maybe a 50-50 % chance of gaining access to Nottingham. If you are interested in an LLM in Human Rights, Essex may be one of the right places for you.
Judging from the experiences of the people I know who have applied to those universities, I feel that you have a good chance of being accepted by Warwick; perhaps an excellent chance of being offered a place at Essex; and maybe a 50-50 % chance of gaining access to Nottingham. If you are interested in an LLM in Human Rights, Essex may be one of the right places for you.
quote
beicon
I second his opinion 100%...
I second his opinion 100%...
quote
Thanks for your advice... Any other good law schools or universities that I might have a good chance of getting in to?

I was also looking into Kent... However, as I am pursuing this degree not to practice as a solicitor, but to work in the field of law at an international level, I wonder if getting into a better recognized "international" university would be priority. Ie/ Warwick has a better international ranking than Essex.

Also, if anyone knows if it would be easier to get accepted into another type of masters, I was thinking of possibly pursuing an International studies degree, obtaining top marks, and then pursuing an LLM.

Any other suggestions, programs, ideas?

Thanks again everyone!
Thanks for your advice... Any other good law schools or universities that I might have a good chance of getting in to?

I was also looking into Kent... However, as I am pursuing this degree not to practice as a solicitor, but to work in the field of law at an international level, I wonder if getting into a better recognized "international" university would be priority. Ie/ Warwick has a better international ranking than Essex.

Also, if anyone knows if it would be easier to get accepted into another type of masters, I was thinking of possibly pursuing an International studies degree, obtaining top marks, and then pursuing an LLM.

Any other suggestions, programs, ideas?

Thanks again everyone!
quote
Kerfuffle
Kitty, the bigger problem you have is not having a law degree (they'll expect you to have a JD/LLB). This will be the main stumbling block and not the 2.2 (excluding the very top universities, most will be quite willing to have an international fee paying student from the UoT). I would say contact all the law schools you're interested in (by-pass admin and email the director of graduate studies/the LLM).

Also consider MA degrees, several universities do an MA in Human Rights (eg. LSE, Sussex, SOAS,York) and will be much less concerned with your absence of legal knowledge. Oxford also does a PT Mst in International Human Rights.
Kitty, the bigger problem you have is not having a law degree (they'll expect you to have a JD/LLB). This will be the main stumbling block and not the 2.2 (excluding the very top universities, most will be quite willing to have an international fee paying student from the UoT). I would say contact all the law schools you're interested in (by-pass admin and email the director of graduate studies/the LLM).

Also consider MA degrees, several universities do an MA in Human Rights (eg. LSE, Sussex, SOAS,York) and will be much less concerned with your absence of legal knowledge. Oxford also does a PT Mst in International Human Rights.
quote
legalalien
Kerfuffle - as always, the voice of reason. Think I might adopt a new strapline - "... and failing that, what Kerfuffle says".

Out of interest, K, are you originally from the UK, or elsewhere?
Kerfuffle - as always, the voice of reason. Think I might adopt a new strapline - "... and failing that, what Kerfuffle says".

Out of interest, K, are you originally from the UK, or elsewhere?
quote
Hi Kerfuffle,

Funny that you mentioned the LLB being an issue, because so far most programs that I've inquired with didn't say it was an issue. However, I've just heard back from a bunch more today, and they list the LLB as a requirement, and say I wouldn't be eligible for their programs (ie/ Bristol, Southampton, Kent).

I am now definitely thinking about the Masters route, and ultimately I could always do a GLD if I wanted to do "Law" per se. Essentially, an LLM would be useless anyway unless I were to take a one year qualifying course afterwards, correct?

And to answer your question, I'm Irish, but have been living in Canada for a number of years.
Hi Kerfuffle,

Funny that you mentioned the LLB being an issue, because so far most programs that I've inquired with didn't say it was an issue. However, I've just heard back from a bunch more today, and they list the LLB as a requirement, and say I wouldn't be eligible for their programs (ie/ Bristol, Southampton, Kent).

I am now definitely thinking about the Masters route, and ultimately I could always do a GLD if I wanted to do "Law" per se. Essentially, an LLM would be useless anyway unless I were to take a one year qualifying course afterwards, correct?

And to answer your question, I'm Irish, but have been living in Canada for a number of years.
quote
kamuguy
hey i went to uoft and did a joint specialist pol sci history. my first and second year grades were were not as good as 3 4 , i applied to warwick and a bunch of others, lse, kings now i study llb warwick.
hey i went to uoft and did a joint specialist pol sci history. my first and second year grades were were not as good as 3 4 , i applied to warwick and a bunch of others, lse, kings now i study llb warwick.
quote
lmwoods
Re qualification as a lawyer: yes you'd need either to do the GDL or possibly the graduate entry LLB. An LLM is unlikely to be a qualifying law degree in the eyes of the professional bodies.

Quite a few places accept students without a law degree, though that sometimes depends on the subjects you want to study and what your background is. They may also limit your choice of options.

Most law schools are now being merged wiht other faculties - often social sciences but not always. How much impact it has on the student experience in practice I don't know. I'd be surprised if it were that noticeable.

Re Essex: its human rights programme is well-renowned so you may struggle with a 2,2 (unless things have changed radically or they're feeling the credit crunch). There is no harm in trying...
Re qualification as a lawyer: yes you'd need either to do the GDL or possibly the graduate entry LLB. An LLM is unlikely to be a qualifying law degree in the eyes of the professional bodies.

Quite a few places accept students without a law degree, though that sometimes depends on the subjects you want to study and what your background is. They may also limit your choice of options.

Most law schools are now being merged wiht other faculties - often social sciences but not always. How much impact it has on the student experience in practice I don't know. I'd be surprised if it were that noticeable.

Re Essex: its human rights programme is well-renowned so you may struggle with a 2,2 (unless things have changed radically or they're feeling the credit crunch). There is no harm in trying...
quote
Sylvain
Hi,

Not having law undergrad would not be a problem at Essex, if you can demonstrate that you are motivated and that you have done something related to international issues before. They give a one week intense course of general international human rights law at the beginning of the year for people who have not done law before.

Best
Sylvain
Hi,

Not having law undergrad would not be a problem at Essex, if you can demonstrate that you are motivated and that you have done something related to international issues before. They give a one week intense course of general international human rights law at the beginning of the year for people who have not done law before.

Best
Sylvain
quote

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