Top Maritime/Admiralty LLM??? Any advice from recent students???


jpm

Hi all

I would be grateful to receive advice on the top maritime LLM course available. I have applied to study at University of Oslo, Swansea University and University of Southampton. I want to study the most prestigious course that adopts a commercial and practical approach to teaching.

I hope to pursue a career as a maritime lawyer in Australia or London.

Any advice or testimonial of recent experience would be very much appreciated.

Just received an offer from Uni of Southampton and would really appreciate to hear recent personal accounts of the course.

Thanks!

Hi all

I would be grateful to receive advice on the top maritime LLM course available. I have applied to study at University of Oslo, Swansea University and University of Southampton. I want to study the most prestigious course that adopts a commercial and practical approach to teaching.

I hope to pursue a career as a maritime lawyer in Australia or London.

Any advice or testimonial of recent experience would be very much appreciated.

Just received an offer from Uni of Southampton and would really appreciate to hear recent personal accounts of the course.

Thanks!
quote
jpm

No love? not a single response in 15 hours of post?

I suppose the question is a bit oxymoronic.. I mean, of course every student will claim the LLM course they did was the best; but, brand loyalty.. who needs it.

So please any response... I would love to hear it!

Merci

No love? not a single response in 15 hours of post?

I suppose the question is a bit oxymoronic.. I mean, of course every student will claim the LLM course they did was the best; but, brand loyalty.. who needs it.

So please any response... I would love to hear it!

Merci
quote
pinarkc

Hello jpm,
Firstly, congratulations for your acceptance from Southampton Uni.
I am a llm student in Swansea Uni now, in Int. Commercial and Maritime Law. These two universities have good repututions in the world, nearly highest in rankings.
1-Southampton
2-Swanse
if the reputition is important for u choose 1.
If u wanna live a beautiful city with friendly Welsh people choose 2.
ı have too many friends who studied in Southampton undergraduate and then they came to swansea for llm. They say that, "Southampton has only reputition but swansea is always better."
Lecturers are important. Admiralty, marine insurance, charterparties, cargo claims have the best lecturers. If u want u can searh the names: Prof D Baris Soyer, Prof D Richard Williams, Prof D Andrew Tettenborn and the head of the shipping instutute is Prof D Rhidian Thomas. They r the best names in Maritime Industry.
Therefore, choice is yours ;)

Hello jpm,
Firstly, congratulations for your acceptance from Southampton Uni.
I am a llm student in Swansea Uni now, in Int. Commercial and Maritime Law. These two universities have good repututions in the world, nearly highest in rankings.
1-Southampton
2-Swanse
if the reputition is important for u choose 1.
If u wanna live a beautiful city with friendly Welsh people choose 2.
ı have too many friends who studied in Southampton undergraduate and then they came to swansea for llm. They say that, "Southampton has only reputition but swansea is always better."
Lecturers are important. Admiralty, marine insurance, charterparties, cargo claims have the best lecturers. If u want u can searh the names: Prof D Baris Soyer, Prof D Richard Williams, Prof D Andrew Tettenborn and the head of the shipping instutute is Prof D Rhidian Thomas. They r the best names in Maritime Industry.
Therefore, choice is yours ;)
quote
jpm

Hi Pinarkc

Thank you very much for your response, very much appreciated! I google searched the Professors you listed and they all appear to have an impressive wealth of expertise and many publications. I thank you for sharing your opinion and those of your friends! Believe I have also been accepted to Swansea. Although the words "accepted" or "offer to study" were never used, it certainly was implied.

To be quite honest I have little knowledge of the UK regions and so am interested to hear that Swansea is a beautiful city. Suppose by implication Southampton is not? I have been to Oslo which is picturesque and am eagerly awaiting their response. The small size of the Norwegian course is very appealing and I imagine it would be a great environment for learning. Having said that I have read that the focus of the study there is very much Norwegian and I don't know if that would affect employment opportunities with international firms. Do you have any friends who are studying or have studied in Oslo?

Thank you again for your post!

Hi Pinarkc

Thank you very much for your response, very much appreciated! I google searched the Professors you listed and they all appear to have an impressive wealth of expertise and many publications. I thank you for sharing your opinion and those of your friends! Believe I have also been accepted to Swansea. Although the words "accepted" or "offer to study" were never used, it certainly was implied.

To be quite honest I have little knowledge of the UK regions and so am interested to hear that Swansea is a beautiful city. Suppose by implication Southampton is not? I have been to Oslo which is picturesque and am eagerly awaiting their response. The small size of the Norwegian course is very appealing and I imagine it would be a great environment for learning. Having said that I have read that the focus of the study there is very much Norwegian and I don't know if that would affect employment opportunities with international firms. Do you have any friends who are studying or have studied in Oslo?

Thank you again for your post!
quote
pinarkc

I have a friend from Norwey and he is doing llm in Swansea as me.
Think about the weather as well. Norwey is in the north, cold etc.
Uk is the best for llm, experienced..

I have a friend from Norwey and he is doing llm in Swansea as me.
Think about the weather as well. Norwey is in the north, cold etc.
Uk is the best for llm, experienced..
quote
flori

Hello everyone,
having obtained my LLM International Martime Law from Swansea University in 2008, I would not consider myself to be a "recent" student. However, this temporal distance might not necessarily be disadvantageous, as the own perception of the LLM programme is no longer blurred by the immediate impressions and brand loyalty respectively brand antagonism tends to wear off as well.

1. Furthermore I should add that my personal reflections regarding the prestige of the programme are limited to my home country, which harbours a not inconsiderable amount of maritime business interest in Europe. So much for openers - and yes, I know that people with more brand loyalty would crucify me for the following assessment:

To put it delicately, the brand-recognition of the LLM Maritime Law Programme in Swansea is marginal at best, whilst almost everyone seems to associate a LLM degree in the respective field from the UK with Soton. Some people have the vague notion of a respective programme in Wales, however they do not link this programme with Swansea, but Cardiff university (the place where the predecessor of the course currently in Swansea took place).

When it comes to the names of the lecturers, it is true that some, though not all hold a considerable reputation in my country -. still this personal reputation does not reflect on the reputation of the programme, as most practitioners are not aware that these people are connected to Swansea University.

Therefore - as far as my country is concerned - one would have to change the statement "Southampton has only reputition but swansea is always better." into "Only Southampton has reputation." As I said before, the assessment of the reputation might and probably will differ in other countries.

For an assessment of the overall prestige/reputation/quality of the respective law school (not the respective programmes) held in Britain, you might want to consider the rankings by the Times or the Guardian.

2. The location of the university campus in Swansea, as well as the accommodation in Ty Beck is splendid. However, I would not consider Swansea to be a beautiful town, it is actually quite far from beautiful. I will remain silent, as far as the weather in Swansea is concerned.

Don't get me wrong, I am not saying that Swansea is a bad choice, it was a terrific choice for me. However, for reasons I will not delve into, "prestige" or "reputation" were no decision criteria for me.

Another issue I will not delve into is the question whether obtaining a LLM in Maritime Law is a meaningful step on the road to become a maritime lawyer in the UK, as the decision on obtaining a LLM as such has already taken place.

Bye and all the best
Flori

Hello everyone,
having obtained my LLM International Martime Law from Swansea University in 2008, I would not consider myself to be a "recent" student. However, this temporal distance might not necessarily be disadvantageous, as the own perception of the LLM programme is no longer blurred by the immediate impressions and brand loyalty respectively brand antagonism tends to wear off as well.

1. Furthermore I should add that my personal reflections regarding the prestige of the programme are limited to my home country, which harbours a not inconsiderable amount of maritime business interest in Europe. So much for openers - and yes, I know that people with more brand loyalty would crucify me for the following assessment:

To put it delicately, the brand-recognition of the LLM Maritime Law Programme in Swansea is marginal at best, whilst almost everyone seems to associate a LLM degree in the respective field from the UK with Soton. Some people have the vague notion of a respective programme in Wales, however they do not link this programme with Swansea, but Cardiff university (the place where the predecessor of the course currently in Swansea took place).

When it comes to the names of the lecturers, it is true that some, though not all hold a considerable reputation in my country -. still this personal reputation does not reflect on the reputation of the programme, as most practitioners are not aware that these people are connected to Swansea University.

Therefore - as far as my country is concerned - one would have to change the statement "Southampton has only reputition but swansea is always better." into "Only Southampton has reputation." As I said before, the assessment of the reputation might and probably will differ in other countries.

For an assessment of the overall prestige/reputation/quality of the respective law school (not the respective programmes) held in Britain, you might want to consider the rankings by the Times or the Guardian.

2. The location of the university campus in Swansea, as well as the accommodation in Ty Beck is splendid. However, I would not consider Swansea to be a beautiful town, it is actually quite far from beautiful. I will remain silent, as far as the weather in Swansea is concerned.

Don't get me wrong, I am not saying that Swansea is a bad choice, it was a terrific choice for me. However, for reasons I will not delve into, "prestige" or "reputation" were no decision criteria for me.

Another issue I will not delve into is the question whether obtaining a LLM in Maritime Law is a meaningful step on the road to become a maritime lawyer in the UK, as the decision on obtaining a LLM as such has already taken place.

Bye and all the best
Flori
quote
jpm

The horror, The horror!

I had written a reply to Flori, however upon clicking on the 'Submit Post' button I was prompted to log in again and the text was lost. Epic fail.

In short, what I had written read as follows:
1. Thank you for your response.
2. From what I am beginning to understand Southampton has a good reputation in commonwealth jurisdictions.
3. Swansea lecturers = very good = perhaps better learning envinronment at Swansea?
4. Am interested to hear your opinion on whether obtaining an LLM will be, as you said, a meaningful step on the road to becoming a maritime lawyer in the UK. Although having submitted 3 applications, am a long way from having decided that this is the right choice for me.

Sorry for the truncated version, I swear it wasn't my fault :)

Thank you all for your contributions.

JPM

The horror, The horror!

I had written a reply to Flori, however upon clicking on the 'Submit Post' button I was prompted to log in again and the text was lost. Epic fail.

In short, what I had written read as follows:
1. Thank you for your response.
2. From what I am beginning to understand Southampton has a good reputation in commonwealth jurisdictions.
3. Swansea lecturers = very good = perhaps better learning envinronment at Swansea?
4. Am interested to hear your opinion on whether obtaining an LLM will be, as you said, a meaningful step on the road to becoming a maritime lawyer in the UK. Although having submitted 3 applications, am a long way from having decided that this is the right choice for me.

Sorry for the truncated version, I swear it wasn't my fault :)

Thank you all for your contributions.

JPM
quote
flori

Hey JPM,
regarding a potentially better learning environment in Swansea compared to the one in Southampton, I cannot offer any meaningful insights as I do not know the learning environment provided by the latter. However, I would not draw such a conclusion from the reputation held by the lecturers. From my own personal experience in Swansea, I would not say that the people with the highest reputation are necessarily the best lecturers. (I will refrain from further details, as the respective perception of lecturer and lecture is as subjective as it can get).

However, when it comes to the learning environment in Swansea I can report on the mediocre to fair quality of the Swansea law library. Whilst it is true, that they hold most, if not all standard works in maritime law, more often than not they only hold one copy. Therefore, if one of the books appears on the reading lists for the subsequent lecture or is relevant for the essays delivered during the year....

Regarding the impact of the LLM on the career path to become a maritime lawyer, one could say that a lot depends on the personal background and that the LLM won't hurt - of course...

However, as far as this career path is concerned, I simply do not see any sustainable evidence that the LLM degree compensates for the amount of time and (probably, as long as you do not have a full scholarship) money invested therein. Given that a more detailed discussion of this question will almost certainly mainly consist of anecdotal evidence (But XY did become a maritime lawyer with the LLM etc.), I think the best choice would be to refer this question to the respective school of law and/or career development department and/or alumni office.

If they are unable to present any meaningful data.....
Bye
Flori

Hey JPM,
regarding a potentially better learning environment in Swansea compared to the one in Southampton, I cannot offer any meaningful insights as I do not know the learning environment provided by the latter. However, I would not draw such a conclusion from the reputation held by the lecturers. From my own personal experience in Swansea, I would not say that the people with the highest reputation are necessarily the best lecturers. (I will refrain from further details, as the respective perception of lecturer and lecture is as subjective as it can get).

However, when it comes to the learning environment in Swansea I can report on the mediocre to fair quality of the Swansea law library. Whilst it is true, that they hold most, if not all standard works in maritime law, more often than not they only hold one copy. Therefore, if one of the books appears on the reading lists for the subsequent lecture or is relevant for the essays delivered during the year....

Regarding the impact of the LLM on the career path to become a maritime lawyer, one could say that a lot depends on the personal background and that the LLM won't hurt - of course...

However, as far as this career path is concerned, I simply do not see any sustainable evidence that the LLM degree compensates for the amount of time and (probably, as long as you do not have a full scholarship) money invested therein. Given that a more detailed discussion of this question will almost certainly mainly consist of anecdotal evidence (But XY did become a maritime lawyer with the LLM etc.), I think the best choice would be to refer this question to the respective school of law and/or career development department and/or alumni office.

If they are unable to present any meaningful data.....
Bye
Flori
quote
dawn

hello
I recently saw this post....and it affects me too.I too face the same decisions.in fact I have to choose in btwn a clat admission at nalsar national law school ,India and an LL.M in maritime law from uk.i have recieved conditional offers from bristol and southampton .....i have to decide soon....need help??????????

hello
I recently saw this post....and it affects me too.I too face the same decisions.in fact I have to choose in btwn a clat admission at nalsar national law school ,India and an LL.M in maritime law from uk.i have recieved conditional offers from bristol and southampton .....i have to decide soon....need help??????????
quote
flori

Given that both Bristol and Southampton are solid choices, I would base the decision on soft factors like accommodation options etc...

Given that both Bristol and Southampton are solid choices, I would base the decision on soft factors like accommodation options etc...
quote

Hey JPM,
regarding a potentially better learning environment in Swansea compared to the one in Southampton, I cannot offer any meaningful insights as I do not know the learning environment provided by the latter. However, I would not draw such a conclusion from the reputation held by the lecturers. From my own personal experience in Swansea, I would not say that the people with the highest reputation are necessarily the best lecturers. (I will refrain from further details, as the respective perception of lecturer and lecture is as subjective as it can get).

However, when it comes to the learning environment in Swansea I can report on the mediocre to fair quality of the Swansea law library. Whilst it is true, that they hold most, if not all standard works in maritime law, more often than not they only hold one copy. Therefore, if one of the books appears on the reading lists for the subsequent lecture or is relevant for the essays delivered during the year....

Regarding the impact of the LLM on the career path to become a maritime lawyer, one could say that a lot depends on the personal background and that the LLM won't hurt - of course...

However, as far as this career path is concerned, I simply do not see any sustainable evidence that the LLM degree compensates for the amount of time and (probably, as long as you do not have a full scholarship) money invested therein. Given that a more detailed discussion of this question will almost certainly mainly consist of anecdotal evidence (But XY did become a maritime lawyer with the LLM etc.), I think the best choice would be to refer this question to the respective school of law and/or career development department and/or alumni office.

If they are unable to present any meaningful data.....
Bye
Flori


Dear Flori

Quite simply, are you trying to say that Swansea University, if one expects it to be an enriching educational as well as employable experience, it may not entirely turn out to be so?

<blockquote>Hey JPM,
regarding a potentially better learning environment in Swansea compared to the one in Southampton, I cannot offer any meaningful insights as I do not know the learning environment provided by the latter. However, I would not draw such a conclusion from the reputation held by the lecturers. From my own personal experience in Swansea, I would not say that the people with the highest reputation are necessarily the best lecturers. (I will refrain from further details, as the respective perception of lecturer and lecture is as subjective as it can get).

However, when it comes to the learning environment in Swansea I can report on the mediocre to fair quality of the Swansea law library. Whilst it is true, that they hold most, if not all standard works in maritime law, more often than not they only hold one copy. Therefore, if one of the books appears on the reading lists for the subsequent lecture or is relevant for the essays delivered during the year....

Regarding the impact of the LLM on the career path to become a maritime lawyer, one could say that a lot depends on the personal background and that the LLM won't hurt - of course...

However, as far as this career path is concerned, I simply do not see any sustainable evidence that the LLM degree compensates for the amount of time and (probably, as long as you do not have a full scholarship) money invested therein. Given that a more detailed discussion of this question will almost certainly mainly consist of anecdotal evidence (But XY did become a maritime lawyer with the LLM etc.), I think the best choice would be to refer this question to the respective school of law and/or career development department and/or alumni office.

If they are unable to present any meaningful data.....
Bye
Flori</blockquote>

Dear Flori

Quite simply, are you trying to say that Swansea University, if one expects it to be an enriching educational as well as employable experience, it may not entirely turn out to be so?
quote
flori

Dear Kumar_Chetti, dear all,
there certainly is a grain of truth in your succinct interpretation.

1. _However_ my personal assessment of the LLM programme is far from universally valid, as it is based on my - more or less - dated personal impressions.

2. Furthermore I would like to point out, that as far as the LLM as an "enriching educational as well as employable experience" is concerned, a serious divergence between pretension and reality is a common thing.

3. I had a great time in Swansea.

Bye
flori

Dear Kumar_Chetti, dear all,
there certainly is a grain of truth in your succinct interpretation.

1. _However_ my personal assessment of the LLM programme is far from universally valid, as it is based on my - more or less - dated personal impressions.

2. Furthermore I would like to point out, that as far as the LLM as an "enriching educational as well as employable experience" is concerned, a serious divergence between pretension and reality is a common thing.

3. I had a great time in Swansea.

Bye
flori
quote
kosta

I also had a great time at Swansea and I owe my job in legal/isnrance practice mainly to Swansea! Go for it!

Kosta

I also had a great time at Swansea and I owe my job in legal/isnrance practice mainly to Swansea! Go for it!

Kosta
quote

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