Bridging the gap to a City firm


Hello

My situation is that I'm in my final year at a top Indian law school, and the top 25 p/c of my class has been picked up by the London offices of the Magic/Silver Circle in the last few months. This is, of course, absolutely unprecedented. I'm barely within the top 50 percentile and hence couldn't get a look-in at the interviews. Given that we don't have class ranks and my grades approximate to 64%, I'm hoping to find a place at UCL/KCL/Nottingham/Warwick/SOAS/LSE. I'm backing myself to do exceptionally well at the LLM, and am hoping that my grades here will persuade the City firms to interview me.

I'd really appreciate advice on the following:
1) Is it okay for one to study non-corporate subjects - juris, labour law - at a good uni, or must one take up commercial subjects to land a job in the CIty?
2) If I start an LLM in Sep 08, do I need to apply online to the firms by the July 31 08 deadline, or can I wait till my LLM grades start appearing and then apply through some meachanism available to LLMs in the UK? If there is such a mechanism, what is it?
3) I have 64% and good references. I'd like to go to a college with an academic bent but good access to the City too. Where should I apply?
4) Are policy institutes, IGOs or academia viable career options after a UK LLM? (I'm keen on a City job only because it seems like a bankable way to pay off the student loan)

Thanks!

Hello

My situation is that I'm in my final year at a top Indian law school, and the top 25 p/c of my class has been picked up by the London offices of the Magic/Silver Circle in the last few months. This is, of course, absolutely unprecedented. I'm barely within the top 50 percentile and hence couldn't get a look-in at the interviews. Given that we don't have class ranks and my grades approximate to 64%, I'm hoping to find a place at UCL/KCL/Nottingham/Warwick/SOAS/LSE. I'm backing myself to do exceptionally well at the LLM, and am hoping that my grades here will persuade the City firms to interview me.

I'd really appreciate advice on the following:
1) Is it okay for one to study non-corporate subjects - juris, labour law - at a good uni, or must one take up commercial subjects to land a job in the CIty?
2) If I start an LLM in Sep 08, do I need to apply online to the firms by the July 31 08 deadline, or can I wait till my LLM grades start appearing and then apply through some meachanism available to LLMs in the UK? If there is such a mechanism, what is it?
3) I have 64% and good references. I'd like to go to a college with an academic bent but good access to the City too. Where should I apply?
4) Are policy institutes, IGOs or academia viable career options after a UK LLM? (I'm keen on a City job only because it seems like a bankable way to pay off the student loan)

Thanks!
quote
deeksha

to get a job first of all you require a work permit and visa, which are very difficult to get. work permit are applied for only by top 10 or so firms for you, it involves a lot of paper work for th e office.

you can study what you enjoy, but just dont expect to get a job in the corporate field/firms after doing an llm in subjects like juris. even the best university then will not be able to propel you in field you desire. that is because llm itself has very litle value in the job market. llm is good for you if you wish to pursue academics, but otherwise also it is a good option if you can find scholarship, but not otherwise. your llb is definitely more imp, especially where you have done it fom, and even more imp is your grade and overall rank in class. in uk a first division is 70%, but they know that in india it is 60% so universities in giving admission will take that into consideration, but typically oxford required 70% and cambridge at least 67-68% , despite indian first division being 60%, also then your overall rank in class and ranking of your college becomes imp for admission. but for a job, all these things are practically useless. llm they hardly give value to unless it is form a top top university and more imp you have a great rank there. so please weigh these things in mind before you decide to do llm.
you can apply anytime for a job, your llm will have practically no bearing, interviews at firms will be really imp, and you should know they are exhaustive consisting of at most 5 stages like interview, panel interview, assesment days, psychometric test, written assingment/test (at least at magic circle). here your cv becomes very imp. yes you can contact your career forums/advisory bodies in your college, and many top firms make direct recruitments from colleges and llm, but then you have to have a good rank in class plus a great college. there are really no deadlines for applications to firms, they take in people all through the year, but training contracts have deadlines.

i dont know how easy/difficult 64% is to achieve in your college. everything is relative and if a topper gets 62% he can get admitted but if a topper has 70%, then 64 stands less chance.
oxford BCL is very highly regarded, and is supposed to have an edge over LLM Cambridge, but oxford course has tutorials and is more intensive than cambridge. these are within 100 km of london, but you cant stay in london and do a course from ox/camb because of strict residence requirements. there are on campus recruitments extensively form these, but i think you may not be able to get admission there.
next in line are lse, ucl, kcl, lse has a greater international recognition, ucl is regarded equally highly in uk, and kcl is traditionally a rival of ucl, but i think ucl scores over kcl. i think you wil be able to ge admission in these colleges in london. for the rest you can do a search in llm guide itself, it will give you rankings. cost of living is higher in london, but you can also get part-time work.

igo, etc are good career options but jobs are limited, though salaries are good. but you will have to have a phd in a relevant field, not jurisprudence, unless you only want to enter academics, staring salaries will be the same as in a good firm, but as you progress salaries in firms definitely outstrip salaries at colleges, plus you will be selected only if you have top grades.

to get a job first of all you require a work permit and visa, which are very difficult to get. work permit are applied for only by top 10 or so firms for you, it involves a lot of paper work for th e office.

you can study what you enjoy, but just dont expect to get a job in the corporate field/firms after doing an llm in subjects like juris. even the best university then will not be able to propel you in field you desire. that is because llm itself has very litle value in the job market. llm is good for you if you wish to pursue academics, but otherwise also it is a good option if you can find scholarship, but not otherwise. your llb is definitely more imp, especially where you have done it fom, and even more imp is your grade and overall rank in class. in uk a first division is 70%, but they know that in india it is 60% so universities in giving admission will take that into consideration, but typically oxford required 70% and cambridge at least 67-68% , despite indian first division being 60%, also then your overall rank in class and ranking of your college becomes imp for admission. but for a job, all these things are practically useless. llm they hardly give value to unless it is form a top top university and more imp you have a great rank there. so please weigh these things in mind before you decide to do llm.
you can apply anytime for a job, your llm will have practically no bearing, interviews at firms will be really imp, and you should know they are exhaustive consisting of at most 5 stages like interview, panel interview, assesment days, psychometric test, written assingment/test (at least at magic circle). here your cv becomes very imp. yes you can contact your career forums/advisory bodies in your college, and many top firms make direct recruitments from colleges and llm, but then you have to have a good rank in class plus a great college. there are really no deadlines for applications to firms, they take in people all through the year, but training contracts have deadlines.

i dont know how easy/difficult 64% is to achieve in your college. everything is relative and if a topper gets 62% he can get admitted but if a topper has 70%, then 64 stands less chance.
oxford BCL is very highly regarded, and is supposed to have an edge over LLM Cambridge, but oxford course has tutorials and is more intensive than cambridge. these are within 100 km of london, but you cant stay in london and do a course from ox/camb because of strict residence requirements. there are on campus recruitments extensively form these, but i think you may not be able to get admission there.
next in line are lse, ucl, kcl, lse has a greater international recognition, ucl is regarded equally highly in uk, and kcl is traditionally a rival of ucl, but i think ucl scores over kcl. i think you wil be able to ge admission in these colleges in london. for the rest you can do a search in llm guide itself, it will give you rankings. cost of living is higher in london, but you can also get part-time work.

igo, etc are good career options but jobs are limited, though salaries are good. but you will have to have a phd in a relevant field, not jurisprudence, unless you only want to enter academics, staring salaries will be the same as in a good firm, but as you progress salaries in firms definitely outstrip salaries at colleges, plus you will be selected only if you have top grades.
quote

Thanks for the prompt reply, deeksha.

So, in your opinion, an LLM with excellent grades from a good college - like UCL or KCL - would translate into job offers from a top City firm?

I thought this made reasonable sense since people from my undergrad class in India are any way getting magic circle offers - these are people with grades in the 65-70% bracket, which i have fallen just short of with my 64%

i have a specific doubt - do LLM's get recruited at campus job fairs by Magic/Silver Circle recruiters? or must I apply online by July 31 this year, by which time i won't even have started my LLM, let alone being able to leverage it in the app!

Thanks..

Thanks for the prompt reply, deeksha.

So, in your opinion, an LLM with excellent grades from a good college - like UCL or KCL - would translate into job offers from a top City firm?

I thought this made reasonable sense since people from my undergrad class in India are any way getting magic circle offers - these are people with grades in the 65-70% bracket, which i have fallen just short of with my 64%

i have a specific doubt - do LLM's get recruited at campus job fairs by Magic/Silver Circle recruiters? or must I apply online by July 31 this year, by which time i won't even have started my LLM, let alone being able to leverage it in the app!

Thanks..
quote
deeksha

thus is my personal view after a lot of research on the net. it may therefore be wrong, i havent even set foot in the uk. i will be reaching around April 2008 for 3 years.
i have read extensively in llm prospectuses that they all have career centres and all top MC firms come to recruit from there. so this can be a shortcut but then you have to be in a top school with top grades and in interview your personality plus scholarship must come thru. this is a direct chance to gain interview which is otherwise very difficult to get. but i dont know what sort of agenda or talent search they have in mind. they definitely want the best and the brightest. in their social circles this bodes well for them.
you are free to apply whenever you want to, but if you get rejected once, ie if they dont call you for interview, (that depends on how your cv is), then most firms will ask yu to wait till one year or so before you reapply and show what marked improvement you have had in one year, and i think llm will not count much . so dont be in a hurry to apply. otherwise you can start in the middle rung, but then the risk is that you will find it more difficult to enter MC after being in a mediocre place as thy will prefer a fresher to someone who is branded a mediocre.
so in short very confusing.

thus is my personal view after a lot of research on the net. it may therefore be wrong, i havent even set foot in the uk. i will be reaching around April 2008 for 3 years.
i have read extensively in llm prospectuses that they all have career centres and all top MC firms come to recruit from there. so this can be a shortcut but then you have to be in a top school with top grades and in interview your personality plus scholarship must come thru. this is a direct chance to gain interview which is otherwise very difficult to get. but i dont know what sort of agenda or talent search they have in mind. they definitely want the best and the brightest. in their social circles this bodes well for them.
you are free to apply whenever you want to, but if you get rejected once, ie if they dont call you for interview, (that depends on how your cv is), then most firms will ask yu to wait till one year or so before you reapply and show what marked improvement you have had in one year, and i think llm will not count much . so dont be in a hurry to apply. otherwise you can start in the middle rung, but then the risk is that you will find it more difficult to enter MC after being in a mediocre place as thy will prefer a fresher to someone who is branded a mediocre.
so in short very confusing.
quote

1) Is it okay for one to study non-corporate subjects - juris, labour law - at a good uni, or must one take up commercial subjects to land a job in the CIty?
Take commercial subjects for the City - otherwise what's the point.

2) If I start an LLM in Sep 08, do I need to apply online to the firms by the July 31 08 deadline, or can I wait till my LLM grades start appearing and then apply through some meachanism available to LLMs in the UK? If there is such a mechanism, what is it?
You won't get your LLM grades until the year after you finish your LLM. There is no mechanism for LLM to apply for law jobs - everyone applies the same way. An LLM degree will not really make any difference to your chances of getting a job in the City unless the LLM is specialised and the job you are applying for requires that specialisation. Your UG degree will be more important. You'll also need a visa to work in the UK (as the above poster pointed out).

3) I have 64% and good references. I'd like to go to a college with an academic bent but good access to the City too. Where should I apply?
Any of the Uni of London colleges. Oxbridge doesn't do anywhere near as many commercial subjects as the Uni of London.

4) Are policy institutes, IGOs or academia viable career options after a UK LLM? (I'm keen on a City job only because it seems like a bankable way to pay off the student loan)
You won't get into IGOs and institutes without some civil service/govt. experience, or a PhD - unless at a very low level.

1) Is it okay for one to study non-corporate subjects - juris, labour law - at a good uni, or must one take up commercial subjects to land a job in the CIty?
Take commercial subjects for the City - otherwise what's the point.

2) If I start an LLM in Sep 08, do I need to apply online to the firms by the July 31 08 deadline, or can I wait till my LLM grades start appearing and then apply through some meachanism available to LLMs in the UK? If there is such a mechanism, what is it?
You won't get your LLM grades until the year after you finish your LLM. There is no mechanism for LLM to apply for law jobs - everyone applies the same way. An LLM degree will not really make any difference to your chances of getting a job in the City unless the LLM is specialised and the job you are applying for requires that specialisation. Your UG degree will be more important. You'll also need a visa to work in the UK (as the above poster pointed out).

3) I have 64% and good references. I'd like to go to a college with an academic bent but good access to the City too. Where should I apply?
Any of the Uni of London colleges. Oxbridge doesn't do anywhere near as many commercial subjects as the Uni of London.

4) Are policy institutes, IGOs or academia viable career options after a UK LLM? (I'm keen on a City job only because it seems like a bankable way to pay off the student loan)
You won't get into IGOs and institutes without some civil service/govt. experience, or a PhD - unless at a very low level.
quote
susiee

3) I have 64% and good references. I'd like to go to a college with an academic bent but good access to the City too. Where should I apply?
Any of the Uni of London colleges. Oxbridge doesn't do anywhere near as many commercial subjects as the Uni of London.


even though oxbridge tends to have a more academic focus, it is looked upon very favourably by city firms - so there's no harm in applying there (although you need to be near the top of your class to get in). best of luck!

<blockquote>3) I have 64% and good references. I'd like to go to a college with an academic bent but good access to the City too. Where should I apply?
Any of the Uni of London colleges. Oxbridge doesn't do anywhere near as many commercial subjects as the Uni of London.
</blockquote>

even though oxbridge tends to have a more academic focus, it is looked upon very favourably by city firms - so there's no harm in applying there (although you need to be near the top of your class to get in). best of luck!
quote
number 1

hey all, i have a very simple question. im in the 4th year of LLB, I have about 62% and some good work experience. i also got a scholarship for my LLB degree. now, would this would be good enough for applying to Oxbridge. if not , then what are the standards? and how hard is it to get into LSE?

hey all, i have a very simple question. im in the 4th year of LLB, I have about 62% and some good work experience. i also got a scholarship for my LLB degree. now, would this would be good enough for applying to Oxbridge. if not , then what are the standards? and how hard is it to get into LSE?
quote

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