...

here is a quote from the CA business and professions code. I bet you have the same provision in MA:

), a person engaging in the business or acting in the capacity of an immigration consultant who is not an active member of the State Bar of California, but is an attorney licensed in another state or territory of the United States and is admitted to practice before the Board of Immigration Appeals or the United States Immigration and Naturalization Service, shall include in any advertisement for services as an immigration consultant a clear and conspicuous statement that the consultant is not an attorney licensed to practice law in California but is an attorney licensed in another state or territory of the United States and is authorized by federal law to represent persons before the Board of Immigration Appeals or the United States Immigration and Naturalization Service.

I am a British self-employed immigration consultant in Canada. I want to strengthen my practice by becoming a lawyer: I am looking at either the JD program by Concord in California or the LL.B at the Univ of London.

Either way, I want to be admitted to the California Bar after my legal education.

The problem is: with an LL.B from London, will the CalBar require more education from me before I sit the exam? Does that mean I will probably need a LLM?

If so, is it possible to do an LLM in one year full time or two years max part-time?

What to do? What to do?

Thanks,
Brit-Am

Hi,
i am lokking for some student loan here in Texas. i want to take admission in SMU, Dallas Texas. i am on H4 and my husband is on H1. is this possible? mind he is not a citizen of USA. would appreciate a reply. thakns

I just got a message from CalBar...even with an LLB from a UK university, if I do not article in the UK and become a fully-fledged member of the Law Society, I WILL HAVE TO DO an LLM or further legal study in order to sit the California Bar:

From: "Esperida, Norma"
>To: "Garreth XXXXXXXXX"
>Subject: RE: Committee of Bar Examiners Question
>Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2005 1242 -0700
>
>Dear Mr. XXXXXXXXX,
>
>No; a 3-year LL.B undergraduate degree from England is not considered an equivalent of a Juris Doctorate degree earned in the United States. Usually, it will only enable an applicant to satisy the pre-legal education requirement, and establish eligibility to take the FYLSX. Under this scenario, an applicant will still be required to complete an additional 3 years of law upon passing the FYLSX. Completion of an LLM degree at any American accredited law school will only enable an applicant to satisfy the FYLSX requirement and receive credit for an additonal one year of law study; hence, he/she will still be required to complete 2 more years of law study thereafter to qualify for ther GBX.
>
>
>Norma Florentino Esperida
>Section Chief
>Eligibility
>Office of Admissions
>State Bar of California
>(213) 765-1510

Hi! Iam an indian law student.
I am planning to sign my articles in a leading law firm of India so as to be eligible to sit for the UK Sol. exams.I would like to know whether this UK Sol. qualification would help me in securing admission in a good LLM university.
Also what would be my job prospects after LLM?
Further,i would also like to know as to which LLM is better with respect to the costs and also carreer wise..
Thanks.

Also, from the discussion board i have got to know that u do not require to do LLM if u want to sit for the California bar exam.However, what would be my carreer prospects if i do qualify as an US attorney without doing my masters in law in any good international law firm?
Basically, is the qualification as an US attorney good enough without an US LLM to get a good job anywhere in the world?
Also,what standing does a US LLM degree hold in carreer oppurtunities?

Thanks.

I know it sounds like we are shopping for easiest jurisdiction to get in but I guess we can rename this discussion board to "Foreign lawyers in the US? You don't need BAR EXAM!!!"
MA went far beyond both CA and NY. Check out Section 6.2:
http://mass.gov/bbe/barapprulesaug2002.pdf
I am moving to Boston :-)

hi smartguy,

I have already troubled u many a times. Really sorry to disturb u, but since u seem to have a better view about the position of jobs for foriegn LLM students in USA.. I request you to answer these, once again:

1. If JD students can get a job without passing their BAR Exam, why is it difficult for LLm studnets to get a job (eitehr be it legal associate, para-legal, reasearch -assistant)?????

2. Also I dont get one thing: I presume that not all JD or LLM students pass tehir Bar Exam, but still they end up getting some jobs in law-firms???? and most of these students prepare for tehir BAr Exam while they are working in Law-firms....So I would liek to know as to what kind of legal jobs do tehy get into and their salary and stuff????

3. Is it difficult to get into mediocre-law firm or small-law firm ....coz atleast I am not expecting big-gains out of my LLM degree...but a legal-aassociate job in a small-firm would also do??

4. Also what are the important areas of laws that the firms would look for???

so these r my major queries...if anybody has answers to this..plz do post it.......i am sure it would be helpul to many otehr students...(well the reason behind asking these questions is that most of teh foriegn studnets take some loan to complete their LLm's in USA and so inorder to repay this laon, we have to find a job finally.)

Yes, i agree with u, but i think that i can have a big chanse to find job with higher salary with degree from ivy-leaque? isnt it?
By the way, do u really think that mya language skills will not increase after one year in USA.?
Because i am planning to admit US ivy-leaque next year......
If i am not mistaken, LLM students must have a lot of practice ( i mean English)

Although dated, this is a great thread started by Smartguy. He is absolutely correct. If you are a lawyer in your home country, common law or civil law, it doesn't matter, you can take the California bar exam and become a California lawyer without any further legal education. You do not need a JD or LLM to take the California bar if you are a lawyer in your home country. You do not need to be a US citizen or permanent resident to take the California bar. However, if you go this route, it will be almost impossible to get a job with a large law firm. If you want to start your own practice, work for a mid sized or small law firm, or work for the government this may be an option for you.

Hi richarddvf,

You're right. This is a great thread satrted by smart guy. I've known that you don't need to be a permanent resident or a US citizen to take the CA Bar. But after being admitted after passing the Bar, would you know if a lawyer would still need a working visa if he intends to practice on his own and not work for a firm? I plan to take the bar July next year so I'm trying to see employment options after passing...

I am not an immigration lawyer, but I am fairly certain that you would need some type of work authorization to open your own law parctice in California. You might want to ask an immigration attorney about getting a work visa once you pass the bar.

To all foreign lawyers in the US (including myself): I hope we all agree on one thing that LLM will never replace JD degree.
If you intend to practice law in the US with LLM you have to understand that you are "handicapped" (class B if it sounds better) from educational point of view.
If all you want from LLM is to be able to sit for NY bar exam, i think i have good news how to save admission headaches and $25,000 tuition + another $10,000 for living expenses.
Here is what you can do:
Stage One: Get admitted to your home Bar.
Stage Two: Take and pass California bax exam as attorney admitted in foreign jurisdiction.
Stage Three: no no no, just two.
Congratulations. You saved $35,000, one year of your life, admission headaches AND you can call your self US attorney now.
Questions?

Hi SmartGuy!

I am a lawyer from Brazil moving to NY. I am enrolling myself in International Law Courses at one of those LLM offered by NY Universities. Please give me some advise, what is the best field to work in NY for a foreigner-lawyer like me? Which field do I have more chance?
Thanks for your help!!!!

Hi SmartGuy!

I am a lawyer from Brazil moving to NY. I am enrolling myself in International Law Courses at one of those LLM offered by NY Universities. Please give me some advise, what is the best field to work in NY for a foreigner-lawyer like me? Which field do I have more chance?
Thanks for your help!!!!

I beg to differ. Large law firms know that anyone with a 3 year law degree from a common law country can sit the NY or CAL bar.

The only advantage I can see in that is if you decide to work for yourself (and there is a legal way to do that under US immigration law) or you speak fluent Spanish and can go work for a small firm in desperate need of a law licensed Spanish speaker. In fact, there is a large demand for Spanish speaking attorneys by small firms in California in the fields of criminal, domestic, and immigration law. So if you speak good Spanish and are eligible to sit the CAL bar, I'd do it without the LLM, at least if you want to work in the US in those practice areas.

However, as far as biglaw is concerned, either in the US or back in your home country, just passing the NY or CAL bar will not give you an advantage over other candidates, unless you have something truly unique to offer, like sought after language skills (Spanish, Russian, Mandarin etc).

So, if you have a good academic background and a few years of relevant work experience back home, then the LLM should suffice e.g., a UK solicitor with a 2.1 LLB from a good UK uni followed by 2 or 3 yrs experience in say corporate finance at a London-based City, MC, or US firm should have little difficulty securing a position in NY after completeing an LLM from a top 20 US law school and passing the NY bar. However, these types are usually able to secure a transfer to NY from London and stay with their firm anyway.

Anyone else i.e., most of us - average to good academics from undergrad law schools in Europe/Asia etc, and little post qualification experience - need the JD, at least to get into biglaw or any medium to large firm in any US city.

Interesting comments. Im actually going at this the reverse - doing a weekend BVC right now and already have 6 years experience in MC and Corporate Finance in Canary Wharf. By UK LLB (which I did part time) was a 2.1 - do you see people with the background you describe moving to NY often? Also, any idea what the pay is at 'big law' in NY - I am around 100K base (pounds) right now but more on the banking side looking to shift over to the legal side.

Thanks

hi, i just joined this blog and find it really informative. i am currently enrolled in the uiv. of london external programme and was wondering if i would qualify to sit the CA bar. i know i looked up the website and it seemed that all u needed was a law degree not neccessarily that u be admitted to the bar in your home country. i am a little confused.

hi, i just joined this blog and find it really informative. i am currently enrolled in the uiv. of london external programme and was wondering if i would qualify to sit the CA bar. i know i looked up the website and it seemed that all u needed was a law degree not neccessarily that u be admitted to the bar in your home country. i am a little confused.