Guys,
I'm preparing to do my LLM next year (starting in 2018).
I was wondering about the general consensus in terms of going to a top law school in the US compared to doing one in the UK.
I am from a South American country. The top schools from each place are relatively known here.
NYU / Harvard / Columbia vs. Cambridge / Oxford / LSE
Posted May 21, 2017 13:13
0
Guys,
I'm preparing to do my LLM next year (starting in 2018).
I was wondering about the general consensus in terms of going to a top law school in the US compared to doing one in the UK.
I am from a South American country. The top schools from each place are relatively known here.
I'm preparing to do my LLM next year (starting in 2018).
I was wondering about the general consensus in terms of going to a top law school in the US compared to doing one in the UK.
I am from a South American country. The top schools from each place are relatively known here.
Posted May 22, 2017 10:23
1
Guys,
I'm preparing to do my LLM next year (starting in 2018).
I was wondering about the general consensus in terms of going to a top law school in the US compared to doing one in the UK.
I am from a South American country. The top schools from each place are relatively known here.
Based on reputation and national/international league tables, which appears to be confirmed by student selectivity (based on the profiles of people from my country who got into their LLM programs over the last 5 years), I think the consensus is:
Tier-1 (in no particular order): Yale, Harvard, Stanford, Cambridge, Oxford
Tier-2 (in no particular order): Columbia, NYU, Chicago, LSE
Tier-1 US schools appear to give more weight to extracurricular activities (editorship in law journals, moot work), while UK schools are more concerned with stellar academic performance (usually top 5%). But they are all very selective, and it is not uncommon that one gets into Harvard, for instance, but gets rejected by Stanford or Cambridge, and vice versa. Tier-2 schools are generally more forgiving with their admissions criteria.
In terms of quality, I think the differences among the tier-1 schools are hairline. You have to factor in your career goal (Yale is best for academicians), specialization (Stanford for IP, Cambridge for international law), cost (UK is generally cheaper), and campus preference (Harvard's campus is laid-back but is a stone's throw from busy Boston).
One consideration which may or may not be important to you is that LLM students share the same class as JD students in US schools, while LLM classes in UK schools are exclusively for LLM students.
edit: added Chicago to tier-2
[Edited by robot6 on May 23, 2017]
[quote]Guys,
I'm preparing to do my LLM next year (starting in 2018).
I was wondering about the general consensus in terms of going to a top law school in the US compared to doing one in the UK.
I am from a South American country. The top schools from each place are relatively known here.[/quote]
Based on reputation and national/international league tables, which appears to be confirmed by student selectivity (based on the profiles of people from my country who got into their LLM programs over the last 5 years), I think the consensus is:
Tier-1 (in no particular order): Yale, Harvard, Stanford, Cambridge, Oxford
Tier-2 (in no particular order): Columbia, NYU, Chicago, LSE
Tier-1 US schools appear to give more weight to extracurricular activities (editorship in law journals, moot work), while UK schools are more concerned with stellar academic performance (usually top 5%). But they are all very selective, and it is not uncommon that one gets into Harvard, for instance, but gets rejected by Stanford or Cambridge, and vice versa. Tier-2 schools are generally more forgiving with their admissions criteria.
In terms of quality, I think the differences among the tier-1 schools are hairline. You have to factor in your career goal (Yale is best for academicians), specialization (Stanford for IP, Cambridge for international law), cost (UK is generally cheaper), and campus preference (Harvard's campus is laid-back but is a stone's throw from busy Boston).
One consideration which may or may not be important to you is that LLM students share the same class as JD students in US schools, while LLM classes in UK schools are exclusively for LLM students.
edit: added Chicago to tier-2
I'm preparing to do my LLM next year (starting in 2018).
I was wondering about the general consensus in terms of going to a top law school in the US compared to doing one in the UK.
I am from a South American country. The top schools from each place are relatively known here.[/quote]
Based on reputation and national/international league tables, which appears to be confirmed by student selectivity (based on the profiles of people from my country who got into their LLM programs over the last 5 years), I think the consensus is:
Tier-1 (in no particular order): Yale, Harvard, Stanford, Cambridge, Oxford
Tier-2 (in no particular order): Columbia, NYU, Chicago, LSE
Tier-1 US schools appear to give more weight to extracurricular activities (editorship in law journals, moot work), while UK schools are more concerned with stellar academic performance (usually top 5%). But they are all very selective, and it is not uncommon that one gets into Harvard, for instance, but gets rejected by Stanford or Cambridge, and vice versa. Tier-2 schools are generally more forgiving with their admissions criteria.
In terms of quality, I think the differences among the tier-1 schools are hairline. You have to factor in your career goal (Yale is best for academicians), specialization (Stanford for IP, Cambridge for international law), cost (UK is generally cheaper), and campus preference (Harvard's campus is laid-back but is a stone's throw from busy Boston).
One consideration which may or may not be important to you is that LLM students share the same class as JD students in US schools, while LLM classes in UK schools are exclusively for LLM students.
edit: added Chicago to tier-2
Posted May 22, 2017 10:36
0
Guys,
I'm preparing to do my LLM next year (starting in 2018).
I was wondering about the general consensus in terms of going to a top law school in the US compared to doing one in the UK.
I am from a South American country. The top schools from each place are relatively known here.
Based on reputation and national/international league tables, which appears to be confirmed by student selectivity (based on the profiles of people from my country who got into their LLM programs over the last 5 years), I think the consensus is:
Tier-1 (in no particular order): Yale, Harvard, Stanford, Cambridge, Oxford
Tier-2 (in no particular order): Columbia, NYU, LSE
Tier-1 US schools appear to give more weight to extracurricular activities (editorship in law journals, moot work), while UK schools are more concerned with stellar academic performance (usually top 5%). But they are all very selective, and it is not uncommon that one gets into Harvard, for instance, but gets rejected by Stanford or Cambridge, and vice versa. Tier-2 schools are generally more forgiving with their admissions criteria.
In terms of quality, I think the differences among the tier-1 schools are hairline. You have to factor in your career goal (Yale is best for academicians), specialization (Stanford for IP, Cambridge for international law), cost (UK is generally cheaper), and campus preference (Harvard's campus is laid-back but is a stone's throw from busy Boston).
One consideration which may or may not be important to you is that LLM students share the same class as JD students in US schools, while LLM classes in UK schools are exclusively for LLM students.
Generally concur with this. The cost difference is very significant for international students.
From a UK perspective, it seems as though Harvard is treated as more prestigious than Cambridge and Oxford. So my order would be:
Tier 1A: Harvard
Tier 1B: Cambridge, Oxford, Stanford and Yale (there is no difference in prestige between Oxford and Cambridge; the difference lies primarily in specialisation)
Tier 2A: Columbia, NYU, LSE (would include UCL in this list as well)
Tier 2B: Other London universities like KCL
[quote][quote]Guys,
I'm preparing to do my LLM next year (starting in 2018).
I was wondering about the general consensus in terms of going to a top law school in the US compared to doing one in the UK.
I am from a South American country. The top schools from each place are relatively known here.[/quote]
Based on reputation and national/international league tables, which appears to be confirmed by student selectivity (based on the profiles of people from my country who got into their LLM programs over the last 5 years), I think the consensus is:
Tier-1 (in no particular order): Yale, Harvard, Stanford, Cambridge, Oxford
Tier-2 (in no particular order): Columbia, NYU, LSE
Tier-1 US schools appear to give more weight to extracurricular activities (editorship in law journals, moot work), while UK schools are more concerned with stellar academic performance (usually top 5%). But they are all very selective, and it is not uncommon that one gets into Harvard, for instance, but gets rejected by Stanford or Cambridge, and vice versa. Tier-2 schools are generally more forgiving with their admissions criteria.
In terms of quality, I think the differences among the tier-1 schools are hairline. You have to factor in your career goal (Yale is best for academicians), specialization (Stanford for IP, Cambridge for international law), cost (UK is generally cheaper), and campus preference (Harvard's campus is laid-back but is a stone's throw from busy Boston).
One consideration which may or may not be important to you is that LLM students share the same class as JD students in US schools, while LLM classes in UK schools are exclusively for LLM students.[/quote]
Generally concur with this. The cost difference is very significant for international students.
From a UK perspective, it seems as though Harvard is treated as more prestigious than Cambridge and Oxford. So my order would be:
Tier 1A: Harvard
Tier 1B: Cambridge, Oxford, Stanford and Yale (there is no difference in prestige between Oxford and Cambridge; the difference lies primarily in specialisation)
Tier 2A: Columbia, NYU, LSE (would include UCL in this list as well)
Tier 2B: Other London universities like KCL
I'm preparing to do my LLM next year (starting in 2018).
I was wondering about the general consensus in terms of going to a top law school in the US compared to doing one in the UK.
I am from a South American country. The top schools from each place are relatively known here.[/quote]
Based on reputation and national/international league tables, which appears to be confirmed by student selectivity (based on the profiles of people from my country who got into their LLM programs over the last 5 years), I think the consensus is:
Tier-1 (in no particular order): Yale, Harvard, Stanford, Cambridge, Oxford
Tier-2 (in no particular order): Columbia, NYU, LSE
Tier-1 US schools appear to give more weight to extracurricular activities (editorship in law journals, moot work), while UK schools are more concerned with stellar academic performance (usually top 5%). But they are all very selective, and it is not uncommon that one gets into Harvard, for instance, but gets rejected by Stanford or Cambridge, and vice versa. Tier-2 schools are generally more forgiving with their admissions criteria.
In terms of quality, I think the differences among the tier-1 schools are hairline. You have to factor in your career goal (Yale is best for academicians), specialization (Stanford for IP, Cambridge for international law), cost (UK is generally cheaper), and campus preference (Harvard's campus is laid-back but is a stone's throw from busy Boston).
One consideration which may or may not be important to you is that LLM students share the same class as JD students in US schools, while LLM classes in UK schools are exclusively for LLM students.[/quote]
Generally concur with this. The cost difference is very significant for international students.
From a UK perspective, it seems as though Harvard is treated as more prestigious than Cambridge and Oxford. So my order would be:
Tier 1A: Harvard
Tier 1B: Cambridge, Oxford, Stanford and Yale (there is no difference in prestige between Oxford and Cambridge; the difference lies primarily in specialisation)
Tier 2A: Columbia, NYU, LSE (would include UCL in this list as well)
Tier 2B: Other London universities like KCL
Posted May 22, 2017 13:43
0
I agree that at least with Oxford there is absolutely no consideration to extracurricular activities except to the extent that it reveals academic achievement - see https://www.law.ox.ac.uk/admissions/postgraduate/postgraduate-admission-faqs
Given what is stated in that FAQ, I didn't elaborate in any way in my Oxford application (e.g. in my personal statement or CV) any of my extracurricular interests. The colleges at Oxford pick you by the content of your Oxford application. I'm not sure whether my lack of reference to any extracurricular activities meant that I didn't get into my preferred college which I think likes students who have good extracurricular activities, particularly in sport.
I agree that at least with Oxford there is absolutely no consideration to extracurricular activities except to the extent that it reveals academic achievement - see https://www.law.ox.ac.uk/admissions/postgraduate/postgraduate-admission-faqs
Given what is stated in that FAQ, I didn't elaborate in any way in my Oxford application (e.g. in my personal statement or CV) any of my extracurricular interests. The colleges at Oxford pick you by the content of your Oxford application. I'm not sure whether my lack of reference to any extracurricular activities meant that I didn't get into my preferred college which I think likes students who have good extracurricular activities, particularly in sport.
Given what is stated in that FAQ, I didn't elaborate in any way in my Oxford application (e.g. in my personal statement or CV) any of my extracurricular interests. The colleges at Oxford pick you by the content of your Oxford application. I'm not sure whether my lack of reference to any extracurricular activities meant that I didn't get into my preferred college which I think likes students who have good extracurricular activities, particularly in sport.
Posted May 22, 2017 16:45
0
I beg to differ, if you compare these schools generally in terms of prestige I almost agree with the abovementioned two posts. But, and this but is so important, these abovementioned US Law schools always open more doors than the above mentioned UK schools. Consider the following:
1) US Law schools allow you to sit for the bar. UK schools don't.
2) passing the bar in the US qualifies you to sit for the UK bar. Not vice versa.
3) The clinics offered by US law schools allow you to make great connections with important people and organizations: being an intern at the UN or interning in the DA's or prosecutor's office.
4) the location of Columbia and NYU is outstanding in terms of both opportunities and fun.
In terms of academia, I believe all the abovementioned are equal except LSE. I translate academica into the quality of professors at these institutions, their international recognition, and their scholarly contributions.
In terms of admission, HYS are way more difficult to get in than Oxbridge. If you are a top student with top credentials you are almost guaranteed a spot in Oxbridge. But you will probably get rejected from HYS if you don't have enough publications, experience, and sth that makes you look like you will make a huge academic contribution or be a notable alumni (which is vague). Also by the numbers provided by LLM guide, and it might sound weird; Cambridge, NYU, and Columbia hold the same acceptance rate of LLMs around 14%.
Consider every aspect before you choose a law school. Also, again, I concur on the above list of prestige ranking with regards to general prestige not a specialization prestige.
Good luck!
[Edited by The will of fire on May 22, 2017]
I beg to differ, if you compare these schools generally in terms of prestige I almost agree with the abovementioned two posts. But, and this but is so important, these abovementioned US Law schools always open more doors than the above mentioned UK schools. Consider the following:
1) US Law schools allow you to sit for the bar. UK schools don't.
2) passing the bar in the US qualifies you to sit for the UK bar. Not vice versa.
3) The clinics offered by US law schools allow you to make great connections with important people and organizations: being an intern at the UN or interning in the DA's or prosecutor's office.
4) the location of Columbia and NYU is outstanding in terms of both opportunities and fun.
In terms of academia, I believe all the abovementioned are equal except LSE. I translate academica into the quality of professors at these institutions, their international recognition, and their scholarly contributions.
In terms of admission, HYS are way more difficult to get in than Oxbridge. If you are a top student with top credentials you are almost guaranteed a spot in Oxbridge. But you will probably get rejected from HYS if you don't have enough publications, experience, and sth that makes you look like you will make a huge academic contribution or be a notable alumni (which is vague). Also by the numbers provided by LLM guide, and it might sound weird; Cambridge, NYU, and Columbia hold the same acceptance rate of LLMs around 14%.
Consider every aspect before you choose a law school. Also, again, I concur on the above list of prestige ranking with regards to general prestige not a specialization prestige.
Good luck!
1) US Law schools allow you to sit for the bar. UK schools don't.
2) passing the bar in the US qualifies you to sit for the UK bar. Not vice versa.
3) The clinics offered by US law schools allow you to make great connections with important people and organizations: being an intern at the UN or interning in the DA's or prosecutor's office.
4) the location of Columbia and NYU is outstanding in terms of both opportunities and fun.
In terms of academia, I believe all the abovementioned are equal except LSE. I translate academica into the quality of professors at these institutions, their international recognition, and their scholarly contributions.
In terms of admission, HYS are way more difficult to get in than Oxbridge. If you are a top student with top credentials you are almost guaranteed a spot in Oxbridge. But you will probably get rejected from HYS if you don't have enough publications, experience, and sth that makes you look like you will make a huge academic contribution or be a notable alumni (which is vague). Also by the numbers provided by LLM guide, and it might sound weird; Cambridge, NYU, and Columbia hold the same acceptance rate of LLMs around 14%.
Consider every aspect before you choose a law school. Also, again, I concur on the above list of prestige ranking with regards to general prestige not a specialization prestige.
Good luck!
Posted May 23, 2017 08:56
1
I beg to differ, if you compare these schools generally in terms of prestige I almost agree with the abovementioned two posts. But, and this but is so important, these abovementioned US Law schools always open more doors than the above mentioned UK schools. Consider the following:
1) US Law schools allow you to sit for the bar. UK schools don't.
2) passing the bar in the US qualifies you to sit for the UK bar. Not vice versa.
3) The clinics offered by US law schools allow you to make great connections with important people and organizations: being an intern at the UN or interning in the DA's or prosecutor's office.
4) the location of Columbia and NYU is outstanding in terms of both opportunities and fun.
In terms of academia, I believe all the abovementioned are equal except LSE. I translate academica into the quality of professors at these institutions, their international recognition, and their scholarly contributions.
In terms of admission, HYS are way more difficult to get in than Oxbridge. If you are a top student with top credentials you are almost guaranteed a spot in Oxbridge. But you will probably get rejected from HYS if you don't have enough publications, experience, and sth that makes you look like you will make a huge academic contribution or be a notable alumni (which is vague). Also by the numbers provided by LLM guide, and it might sound weird; Cambridge, NYU, and Columbia hold the same acceptance rate of LLMs around 14%.
Consider every aspect before you choose a law school. Also, again, I concur on the above list of prestige ranking with regards to general prestige not a specialization prestige.
Good luck!
I agree that US schools tend to open more doors. If the OP is interested in working in the US, that certainly is a consideration.
However, I would like to dispute this myth that "HYS are way more difficult to get in than Oxbridge" or that Oxbridge is somehow equal to NYU/Columbia. For Yale and Stanford, perhaps, that is true to a certain extent because of the very limited number of LLM slots available. Yale admits around 30, while Stanford does around 15-20 per program. But, as I mentioned in my earlier post, it is not uncommon that one gets into Cambridge but is rejected by Yale, or someone gets into Harvard but is rejected by Oxford. These universities look for different things. That's why I mentioned in my post that US schools appear to give more emphasis to extracurricular work, while UK schools are strict with academic performance. If you have to compare, which is harder to achieve: graduate in the top 5% of the class or graduate in the top 20% while doing moot work? You'll get many different answers, which is why a categorical statement that "HYS are way more difficult to get in than Oxbridge" is incorrect. Another way to put it is that US schools tend to go for holistic applicants, while Oxbridge tend to go for academic achievers. This is reflected in the application itself, as lengthy personal statements are staples in US applications, while Oxbridge limits you to around 300 words.
I would also dispute the statement that "Cambridge, NYU, and Columbia hold the same acceptance rate of LLMs around 14%." True acceptance rate is number of offers divided by number of applicants. The 14% is actually the enrollment rate--based on number of students who took a place in the program divided by the number of applicants. Schools know that not all who received offers would enroll in the program for a variety of reasons. Columbia and NYU tend to fare better in terms of enrollment rate because they are often the back-up choices of HYS applicants. Those who get into HYS would almost invariably go there, which means that fewer offer-holders would actually enroll in Columbia and NYU. The same can be said with respect to the relationship between Oxbridge and LSE. Unfortunately, US schools don't release number of offers made, so it's difficult to make a precise comparison.
[Edited by robot6 on May 23, 2017]
[quote]I beg to differ, if you compare these schools generally in terms of prestige I almost agree with the abovementioned two posts. But, and this but is so important, these abovementioned US Law schools always open more doors than the above mentioned UK schools. Consider the following:
1) US Law schools allow you to sit for the bar. UK schools don't.
2) passing the bar in the US qualifies you to sit for the UK bar. Not vice versa.
3) The clinics offered by US law schools allow you to make great connections with important people and organizations: being an intern at the UN or interning in the DA's or prosecutor's office.
4) the location of Columbia and NYU is outstanding in terms of both opportunities and fun.
In terms of academia, I believe all the abovementioned are equal except LSE. I translate academica into the quality of professors at these institutions, their international recognition, and their scholarly contributions.
In terms of admission, HYS are way more difficult to get in than Oxbridge. If you are a top student with top credentials you are almost guaranteed a spot in Oxbridge. But you will probably get rejected from HYS if you don't have enough publications, experience, and sth that makes you look like you will make a huge academic contribution or be a notable alumni (which is vague). Also by the numbers provided by LLM guide, and it might sound weird; Cambridge, NYU, and Columbia hold the same acceptance rate of LLMs around 14%.
Consider every aspect before you choose a law school. Also, again, I concur on the above list of prestige ranking with regards to general prestige not a specialization prestige.
Good luck! [/quote]
I agree that US schools tend to open more doors. If the OP is interested in working in the US, that certainly is a consideration.
However, I would like to dispute this myth that "HYS are way more difficult to get in than Oxbridge" or that Oxbridge is somehow equal to NYU/Columbia. For Yale and Stanford, perhaps, that is true to a certain extent because of the very limited number of LLM slots available. Yale admits around 30, while Stanford does around 15-20 per program. But, as I mentioned in my earlier post, it is not uncommon that one gets into Cambridge but is rejected by Yale, or someone gets into Harvard but is rejected by Oxford. These universities look for different things. That's why I mentioned in my post that US schools appear to give more emphasis to extracurricular work, while UK schools are strict with academic performance. If you have to compare, which is harder to achieve: graduate in the top 5% of the class or graduate in the top 20% while doing moot work? You'll get many different answers, which is why a categorical statement that "HYS are way more difficult to get in than Oxbridge" is incorrect. Another way to put it is that US schools tend to go for holistic applicants, while Oxbridge tend to go for academic achievers. This is reflected in the application itself, as lengthy personal statements are staples in US applications, while Oxbridge limits you to around 300 words.
I would also dispute the statement that "Cambridge, NYU, and Columbia hold the same acceptance rate of LLMs around 14%." True acceptance rate is number of offers divided by number of applicants. The 14% is actually the enrollment rate--based on number of students who took a place in the program divided by the number of applicants. Schools know that not all who received offers would enroll in the program for a variety of reasons. Columbia and NYU tend to fare better in terms of enrollment rate because they are often the back-up choices of HYS applicants. Those who get into HYS would almost invariably go there, which means that fewer offer-holders would actually enroll in Columbia and NYU. The same can be said with respect to the relationship between Oxbridge and LSE. Unfortunately, US schools don't release number of offers made, so it's difficult to make a precise comparison.
1) US Law schools allow you to sit for the bar. UK schools don't.
2) passing the bar in the US qualifies you to sit for the UK bar. Not vice versa.
3) The clinics offered by US law schools allow you to make great connections with important people and organizations: being an intern at the UN or interning in the DA's or prosecutor's office.
4) the location of Columbia and NYU is outstanding in terms of both opportunities and fun.
In terms of academia, I believe all the abovementioned are equal except LSE. I translate academica into the quality of professors at these institutions, their international recognition, and their scholarly contributions.
In terms of admission, HYS are way more difficult to get in than Oxbridge. If you are a top student with top credentials you are almost guaranteed a spot in Oxbridge. But you will probably get rejected from HYS if you don't have enough publications, experience, and sth that makes you look like you will make a huge academic contribution or be a notable alumni (which is vague). Also by the numbers provided by LLM guide, and it might sound weird; Cambridge, NYU, and Columbia hold the same acceptance rate of LLMs around 14%.
Consider every aspect before you choose a law school. Also, again, I concur on the above list of prestige ranking with regards to general prestige not a specialization prestige.
Good luck! [/quote]
I agree that US schools tend to open more doors. If the OP is interested in working in the US, that certainly is a consideration.
However, I would like to dispute this myth that "HYS are way more difficult to get in than Oxbridge" or that Oxbridge is somehow equal to NYU/Columbia. For Yale and Stanford, perhaps, that is true to a certain extent because of the very limited number of LLM slots available. Yale admits around 30, while Stanford does around 15-20 per program. But, as I mentioned in my earlier post, it is not uncommon that one gets into Cambridge but is rejected by Yale, or someone gets into Harvard but is rejected by Oxford. These universities look for different things. That's why I mentioned in my post that US schools appear to give more emphasis to extracurricular work, while UK schools are strict with academic performance. If you have to compare, which is harder to achieve: graduate in the top 5% of the class or graduate in the top 20% while doing moot work? You'll get many different answers, which is why a categorical statement that "HYS are way more difficult to get in than Oxbridge" is incorrect. Another way to put it is that US schools tend to go for holistic applicants, while Oxbridge tend to go for academic achievers. This is reflected in the application itself, as lengthy personal statements are staples in US applications, while Oxbridge limits you to around 300 words.
I would also dispute the statement that "Cambridge, NYU, and Columbia hold the same acceptance rate of LLMs around 14%." True acceptance rate is number of offers divided by number of applicants. The 14% is actually the enrollment rate--based on number of students who took a place in the program divided by the number of applicants. Schools know that not all who received offers would enroll in the program for a variety of reasons. Columbia and NYU tend to fare better in terms of enrollment rate because they are often the back-up choices of HYS applicants. Those who get into HYS would almost invariably go there, which means that fewer offer-holders would actually enroll in Columbia and NYU. The same can be said with respect to the relationship between Oxbridge and LSE. Unfortunately, US schools don't release number of offers made, so it's difficult to make a precise comparison.
Posted Jun 18, 2017 17:57
0
Want to go back to the very interesting statement that
US universities do more of an "overall-assessment" of applications ( of course academics but also extracurriculars, second degree etc) whereas UK universities mostly pay attention to academic performance.
Is that really true?
Would like to hear your opinions/ experiences!
[Edited by caroku on Jun 18, 2017]
Want to go back to the very interesting statement that
US universities do more of an "overall-assessment" of applications ( of course academics but also extracurriculars, second degree etc) whereas UK universities mostly pay attention to academic performance.
Is that really true?
Would like to hear your opinions/ experiences!
US universities do more of an "overall-assessment" of applications ( of course academics but also extracurriculars, second degree etc) whereas UK universities mostly pay attention to academic performance.
Is that really true?
Would like to hear your opinions/ experiences!
Posted Jun 20, 2017 15:51
0
Want to go back to the very interesting statement that
US universities do more of an "overall-assessment" of applications ( of course academics but also extracurriculars, second degree etc) whereas UK universities mostly pay attention to academic performance.
Is that really true?
Would like to hear your opinions/ experiences!
When two opposing opinions from a US and a UK LLM candidates agree on a certain "statement", it is more likely to be true than hearing it from the Law schools themselves.
[Edited by The will of fire on Jun 20, 2017]
[quote]Want to go back to the very interesting statement that
US universities do more of an "overall-assessment" of applications ( of course academics but also extracurriculars, second degree etc) whereas UK universities mostly pay attention to academic performance.
Is that really true?
Would like to hear your opinions/ experiences! [/quote]
When two opposing opinions from a US and a UK LLM candidates agree on a certain "statement", it is more likely to be true than hearing it from the Law schools themselves.
US universities do more of an "overall-assessment" of applications ( of course academics but also extracurriculars, second degree etc) whereas UK universities mostly pay attention to academic performance.
Is that really true?
Would like to hear your opinions/ experiences! [/quote]
When two opposing opinions from a US and a UK LLM candidates agree on a certain "statement", it is more likely to be true than hearing it from the Law schools themselves.
Posted Jun 21, 2017 08:44
0
Gotcha !
so no chance with an 3.65 GPA- top 10 % in a good UK Law school...
[Edited by caroku on Jun 21, 2017]
Gotcha !
so no chance with an 3.65 GPA- top 10 % in a good UK Law school...
so no chance with an 3.65 GPA- top 10 % in a good UK Law school...
Posted Jun 24, 2017 19:26
0
Gotcha !
so no chance with an 3.65 GPA- top 10 % in a good UK Law school...
In life, there is nothing; literally nothing, that is like " no chance". There is always a chance in everything. Try your luck and then make a decision. I have a friend who ranked as the 9th and went to Cambridge's McL program. On the other hand, I never applied to Oxbridge, but got into my 1st choice (NYU) for International Law and I rank in the top 5 (1%). US Law schools are seriously more competitive that UK Law schools in general, because 90% of foreign lawyers want to pass the bar after the LLM. You will notice that Cambridge's applications are equal to Chicago's; around 950 applications. While other top US Law schools like Harvard gets 1400, Columbia gets around 1700 applications, NYU gets around 2800+ applications. Try applying to all of these schools with perfect applications, perfect LoRs, perfect everything, and update me when you get into anyone of them or even your desired one to congratulate you. ;)
Good luck.
[Edited by The will of fire on Jun 24, 2017]
[quote]Gotcha !
so no chance with an 3.65 GPA- top 10 % in a good UK Law school...[/quote]
In life, there is nothing; literally nothing, that is like " no chance". There is always a chance in everything. Try your luck and then make a decision. I have a friend who ranked as the 9th and went to Cambridge's McL program. On the other hand, I never applied to Oxbridge, but got into my 1st choice (NYU) for International Law and I rank in the top 5 (1%). US Law schools are seriously more competitive that UK Law schools in general, because 90% of foreign lawyers want to pass the bar after the LLM. You will notice that Cambridge's applications are equal to Chicago's; around 950 applications. While other top US Law schools like Harvard gets 1400, Columbia gets around 1700 applications, NYU gets around 2800+ applications. Try applying to all of these schools with perfect applications, perfect LoRs, perfect everything, and update me when you get into anyone of them or even your desired one to congratulate you. ;)
Good luck.
so no chance with an 3.65 GPA- top 10 % in a good UK Law school...[/quote]
In life, there is nothing; literally nothing, that is like " no chance". There is always a chance in everything. Try your luck and then make a decision. I have a friend who ranked as the 9th and went to Cambridge's McL program. On the other hand, I never applied to Oxbridge, but got into my 1st choice (NYU) for International Law and I rank in the top 5 (1%). US Law schools are seriously more competitive that UK Law schools in general, because 90% of foreign lawyers want to pass the bar after the LLM. You will notice that Cambridge's applications are equal to Chicago's; around 950 applications. While other top US Law schools like Harvard gets 1400, Columbia gets around 1700 applications, NYU gets around 2800+ applications. Try applying to all of these schools with perfect applications, perfect LoRs, perfect everything, and update me when you get into anyone of them or even your desired one to congratulate you. ;)
Good luck.
Posted Jun 25, 2017 14:32
0
That was my plan anyway !
I don't know somehow your post gets me really motivated to really give it a good try - thanks for that :)
Might wait 1/2 years ( just graduated) and then roll up the field from "behind" !
and: Congratulations on NYU !
[Edited by caroku on Jun 25, 2017]
That was my plan anyway !
I don't know somehow your post gets me really motivated to really give it a good try - thanks for that :)
Might wait 1/2 years ( just graduated) and then roll up the field from "behind" !
and: Congratulations on NYU !
I don't know somehow your post gets me really motivated to really give it a good try - thanks for that :)
Might wait 1/2 years ( just graduated) and then roll up the field from "behind" !
and: Congratulations on NYU !
Posted Jul 09, 2017 07:59
0
You will notice that Cambridge's applications are equal to Chicago's; around 950 applications. While other top US Law schools like Harvard gets 1400, Columbia gets around 1700 applications, NYU gets around 2800+ applications.
Is this because the NY bar is open to students from common law countries?
How are the job prospects in NYC for a LLM student from NYU compared to HYS?
[quote]
You will notice that Cambridge's applications are equal to Chicago's; around 950 applications. While other top US Law schools like Harvard gets 1400, Columbia gets around 1700 applications, NYU gets around 2800+ applications.
[/quote]
Is this because the NY bar is open to students from common law countries?
How are the job prospects in NYC for a LLM student from NYU compared to HYS?
You will notice that Cambridge's applications are equal to Chicago's; around 950 applications. While other top US Law schools like Harvard gets 1400, Columbia gets around 1700 applications, NYU gets around 2800+ applications.
[/quote]
Is this because the NY bar is open to students from common law countries?
How are the job prospects in NYC for a LLM student from NYU compared to HYS?
Posted Jul 09, 2017 20:58
1
You will notice that Cambridge's applications are equal to Chicago's; around 950 applications. While other top US Law schools like Harvard gets 1400, Columbia gets around 1700 applications, NYU gets around 2800+ applications.
Is this because the NY bar is open to students from common law countries?
It is open to all foreign trained lawyers after obtaining the LLM and fulfilling the NY bar requirements.
- How are the job prospects in NYC for a LLM student from NYU compared to HYS?
Job prospects are not so high in the US no matter what Law school you go to. And it is pretty logical for an employer not to hire an LLM grad who has an F1 visa and then go through a cumbersome of processes to convert his visa to H1B1 and then to Green Card if he wants him permanently. While he has the chance to hire an American citizen with no visa troublesome and with a 3 year JD instead of a single year LLM.
However, NYU is ranked first in the Law schools best presented in the world's biggest Law firms:
https://llm-guide.com/articles/how-many-big-law-associates-and-partners-have-an-llm
Also, it is ranked 2nd after Pennsylvania for career prospects in the US, while Harvard and Stanford are no.5 and 6., and Yale is number 9 or 10 I guess. You can check this out in this link:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jeffkauflin/2016/10/07/the-best-law-schools-for-career-prospects-2017/#3364e8e35976
[Edited by The will of fire on Jul 09, 2017]
[quote][quote]
You will notice that Cambridge's applications are equal to Chicago's; around 950 applications. While other top US Law schools like Harvard gets 1400, Columbia gets around 1700 applications, NYU gets around 2800+ applications.
[/quote]
Is this because the NY bar is open to students from common law countries? [/quote]
It is open to all foreign trained lawyers after obtaining the LLM and fulfilling the NY bar requirements.
- How are the job prospects in NYC for a LLM student from NYU compared to HYS?[/quote]
Job prospects are not so high in the US no matter what Law school you go to. And it is pretty logical for an employer not to hire an LLM grad who has an F1 visa and then go through a cumbersome of processes to convert his visa to H1B1 and then to Green Card if he wants him permanently. While he has the chance to hire an American citizen with no visa troublesome and with a 3 year JD instead of a single year LLM.
However, NYU is ranked first in the Law schools best presented in the world's biggest Law firms:
https://llm-guide.com/articles/how-many-big-law-associates-and-partners-have-an-llm
Also, it is ranked 2nd after Pennsylvania for career prospects in the US, while Harvard and Stanford are no.5 and 6., and Yale is number 9 or 10 I guess. You can check this out in this link:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jeffkauflin/2016/10/07/the-best-law-schools-for-career-prospects-2017/#3364e8e35976
You will notice that Cambridge's applications are equal to Chicago's; around 950 applications. While other top US Law schools like Harvard gets 1400, Columbia gets around 1700 applications, NYU gets around 2800+ applications.
[/quote]
Is this because the NY bar is open to students from common law countries? [/quote]
It is open to all foreign trained lawyers after obtaining the LLM and fulfilling the NY bar requirements.
- How are the job prospects in NYC for a LLM student from NYU compared to HYS?[/quote]
Job prospects are not so high in the US no matter what Law school you go to. And it is pretty logical for an employer not to hire an LLM grad who has an F1 visa and then go through a cumbersome of processes to convert his visa to H1B1 and then to Green Card if he wants him permanently. While he has the chance to hire an American citizen with no visa troublesome and with a 3 year JD instead of a single year LLM.
However, NYU is ranked first in the Law schools best presented in the world's biggest Law firms:
https://llm-guide.com/articles/how-many-big-law-associates-and-partners-have-an-llm
Also, it is ranked 2nd after Pennsylvania for career prospects in the US, while Harvard and Stanford are no.5 and 6., and Yale is number 9 or 10 I guess. You can check this out in this link:
https://www.forbes.com/sites/jeffkauflin/2016/10/07/the-best-law-schools-for-career-prospects-2017/#3364e8e35976
Posted Jul 10, 2017 12:16
0
^ do notice the first link provides stats on LLM grads working on firms outside the US. And though I didn't check, the second one probably refers to JDs.
Adding to the reply above, IMO your chances on landing a job depend on your law firm, how 'hot' your country is in re business, and your practice (IP, corporate and international litigation, for example). The name of your LLM school helps, but is not decisive.
^ do notice the first link provides stats on LLM grads working on firms outside the US. And though I didn't check, the second one probably refers to JDs.
Adding to the reply above, IMO your chances on landing a job depend on your law firm, how 'hot' your country is in re business, and your practice (IP, corporate and international litigation, for example). The name of your LLM school helps, but is not decisive.
Adding to the reply above, IMO your chances on landing a job depend on your law firm, how 'hot' your country is in re business, and your practice (IP, corporate and international litigation, for example). The name of your LLM school helps, but is not decisive.
Posted Jul 13, 2017 08:58
0
Thanks! Also, NYU does seem to offer more scholarships
Thanks! Also, NYU does seem to offer more scholarships
Posted Aug 08, 2017 16:41
0
Guys,
I'm preparing to do my LLM next year (starting in 2018).
I was wondering about the general consensus in terms of going to a top law school in the US compared to doing one in the UK.
I am from a South American country. The top schools from each place are relatively known here.
The first thing you need to know is that the ranking of US Law Schools is very different from the LLM ranking. Harvard is ranked as a tip US law school because they require extremely high LSAT scores and their admission process is very selective and it is extremely difficult to get in there, same happens with all top US Law schools. LLMs are a different story. You do not need the LSAT and admissions are way more relaxed, so for any employer that actually knows this, an LLM from Harvard does not have that much weight because they know it is not the same as the JD. In all case you need to look at the actual.LLM rankings and look for a program that is in the top.
[Edited by Marlamer on Aug 08, 2017]
[quote]Guys,
I'm preparing to do my LLM next year (starting in 2018).
I was wondering about the general consensus in terms of going to a top law school in the US compared to doing one in the UK.
I am from a South American country. The top schools from each place are relatively known here.[/quote]
The first thing you need to know is that the ranking of US Law Schools is very different from the LLM ranking. Harvard is ranked as a tip US law school because they require extremely high LSAT scores and their admission process is very selective and it is extremely difficult to get in there, same happens with all top US Law schools. LLMs are a different story. You do not need the LSAT and admissions are way more relaxed, so for any employer that actually knows this, an LLM from Harvard does not have that much weight because they know it is not the same as the JD. In all case you need to look at the actual.LLM rankings and look for a program that is in the top.
I'm preparing to do my LLM next year (starting in 2018).
I was wondering about the general consensus in terms of going to a top law school in the US compared to doing one in the UK.
I am from a South American country. The top schools from each place are relatively known here.[/quote]
The first thing you need to know is that the ranking of US Law Schools is very different from the LLM ranking. Harvard is ranked as a tip US law school because they require extremely high LSAT scores and their admission process is very selective and it is extremely difficult to get in there, same happens with all top US Law schools. LLMs are a different story. You do not need the LSAT and admissions are way more relaxed, so for any employer that actually knows this, an LLM from Harvard does not have that much weight because they know it is not the same as the JD. In all case you need to look at the actual.LLM rankings and look for a program that is in the top.
Posted Aug 08, 2017 16:48
0
Guys,
I'm preparing to do my LLM next year (starting in 2018).
I was wondering about the general consensus in terms of going to a top law school in the US compared to doing one in the UK.
I am from a South American country. The top schools from each place are relatively known here.
Based on reputation and national/international league tables, which appears to be confirmed by student selectivity (based on the profiles of people from my country who got into their LLM programs over the last 5 years), I think the consensus is:
Tier-1 (in no particular order): Yale, Harvard, Stanford, Cambridge, Oxford
Tier-2 (in no particular order): Columbia, NYU, Chicago, LSE
Tier-1 US schools appear to give more weight to extracurricular activities (editorship in law journals, moot work), while UK schools are more concerned with stellar academic performance (usually top 5%). But they are all very selective, and it is not uncommon that one gets into Harvard, for instance, but gets rejected by Stanford or Cambridge, and vice versa. Tier-2 schools are generally more forgiving with their admissions criteria.
In terms of quality, I think the differences among the tier-1 schools are hairline. You have to factor in your career goal (Yale is best for academicians), specialization (Stanford for IP, Cambridge for international law), cost (UK is generally cheaper), and campus preference (Harvard's campus is laid-back but is a stone's throw from busy Boston).
One consideration which may or may not be important to you is that LLM students share the same class as JD students in US schools, while LLM classes in UK schools are exclusively for LLM students.
edit: added Chicago to tier-2
I beg to differ too but because as I said, in the US this would apply for a Juris Doctor, but not for an LLM
[quote][quote]Guys,
I'm preparing to do my LLM next year (starting in 2018).
I was wondering about the general consensus in terms of going to a top law school in the US compared to doing one in the UK.
I am from a South American country. The top schools from each place are relatively known here.[/quote]
Based on reputation and national/international league tables, which appears to be confirmed by student selectivity (based on the profiles of people from my country who got into their LLM programs over the last 5 years), I think the consensus is:
Tier-1 (in no particular order): Yale, Harvard, Stanford, Cambridge, Oxford
Tier-2 (in no particular order): Columbia, NYU, Chicago, LSE
Tier-1 US schools appear to give more weight to extracurricular activities (editorship in law journals, moot work), while UK schools are more concerned with stellar academic performance (usually top 5%). But they are all very selective, and it is not uncommon that one gets into Harvard, for instance, but gets rejected by Stanford or Cambridge, and vice versa. Tier-2 schools are generally more forgiving with their admissions criteria.
In terms of quality, I think the differences among the tier-1 schools are hairline. You have to factor in your career goal (Yale is best for academicians), specialization (Stanford for IP, Cambridge for international law), cost (UK is generally cheaper), and campus preference (Harvard's campus is laid-back but is a stone's throw from busy Boston).
One consideration which may or may not be important to you is that LLM students share the same class as JD students in US schools, while LLM classes in UK schools are exclusively for LLM students.
edit: added Chicago to tier-2[/quote]
I beg to differ too but because as I said, in the US this would apply for a Juris Doctor, but not for an LLM
I'm preparing to do my LLM next year (starting in 2018).
I was wondering about the general consensus in terms of going to a top law school in the US compared to doing one in the UK.
I am from a South American country. The top schools from each place are relatively known here.[/quote]
Based on reputation and national/international league tables, which appears to be confirmed by student selectivity (based on the profiles of people from my country who got into their LLM programs over the last 5 years), I think the consensus is:
Tier-1 (in no particular order): Yale, Harvard, Stanford, Cambridge, Oxford
Tier-2 (in no particular order): Columbia, NYU, Chicago, LSE
Tier-1 US schools appear to give more weight to extracurricular activities (editorship in law journals, moot work), while UK schools are more concerned with stellar academic performance (usually top 5%). But they are all very selective, and it is not uncommon that one gets into Harvard, for instance, but gets rejected by Stanford or Cambridge, and vice versa. Tier-2 schools are generally more forgiving with their admissions criteria.
In terms of quality, I think the differences among the tier-1 schools are hairline. You have to factor in your career goal (Yale is best for academicians), specialization (Stanford for IP, Cambridge for international law), cost (UK is generally cheaper), and campus preference (Harvard's campus is laid-back but is a stone's throw from busy Boston).
One consideration which may or may not be important to you is that LLM students share the same class as JD students in US schools, while LLM classes in UK schools are exclusively for LLM students.
edit: added Chicago to tier-2[/quote]
I beg to differ too but because as I said, in the US this would apply for a Juris Doctor, but not for an LLM
Posted Dec 26, 2017 20:34
0
I earned a MA in Legal and Political Theory at UCL and had courses with a LLM student that denied Harvard to accept a place at UCL. There was also a Columbia Law School student in the same class who was completing an LLM in the UK to prepare for a job at a prestigious London law firm.
I earned a MA in Legal and Political Theory at UCL and had courses with a LLM student that denied Harvard to accept a place at UCL. There was also a Columbia Law School student in the same class who was completing an LLM in the UK to prepare for a job at a prestigious London law firm.
Posted Dec 27, 2017 11:22
1
Sorry to be nosy, but I am a bit curious now as you appear to be quite a successful student. If you were previously admitted to the BCL at Oxford, why are you applying to LLM programs again?
Sorry to be nosy, but I am a bit curious now as you appear to be quite a successful student. If you were previously admitted to the BCL at Oxford, why are you applying to LLM programs again?
Posted Dec 27, 2017 22:04
0
Sorry to be nosy, but I am a bit curious now as you appear to be quite a successful student. If you were previously admitted to the BCL at Oxford, why are you applying to LLM programs again?
To put my comment in context, the poster I directed my comment to has deleted his account subsequent to my query.
[quote]Sorry to be nosy, but I am a bit curious now as you appear to be quite a successful student. If you were previously admitted to the BCL at Oxford, why are you applying to LLM programs again?[/quote]
To put my comment in context, the poster I directed my comment to has deleted his account subsequent to my query.
To put my comment in context, the poster I directed my comment to has deleted his account subsequent to my query.
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